|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 8:26 pm
Since I can't fall asleep I figured trying to think up a new feature for this guild would be better than staring at the giant moth on the ceiling. So here it is, the skeptical topic of the week. I figure a few of us can take turns picking out themes of interest and reporting on it. This week's was inspired by a thread that showed up in ED. Firsts things first, what is an otherkin? Since they appear to breed in the internet we will use wikipedia, which is probably edited by several otherkin, to provide us with a definition. Quote: Otherkin is a subculture made up of people who consider themselves non-human or having a connection to a mythical archetype in some way, usually believing to be mythological or legendary creatures. Common creatures to which Otherkin claim some connection include angels, demons, elves, fairies, lycanthropes, and even extra-terrestrials.The otherkin community grew out of the elven online community of the early-to-mid-1990s, with the earliest recorded use of the term otherkin appearing in early 1996. Splendid. But how do they believe themselves to be connected to these creatures? An article on otherkin.net : http://www.otherkin.net/articles/what.html It is summed up as biology, reincarnation, some sort of "spirit" issue or being deluded/mentally ill. If you look at enough websites, you see that the otherkin themselves can't even decide exactly what the hell they are. However, they are always happy to help point out facts. For example, are vampire made or born? http://www.embracingmystery.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=956 Quote: I'm going to assume you mean FICTIONAL vampires in your post. Because REAL vampires ARE BORN. It's IMPOSSIBLE to "make" or "turn" someone. Try getting the facts before posting concepts which are, well, totally incorrect. In case you didn't know, EM's sister board is called Drink Deeply and Dream: The Reality of the Modern Day Vampire. I created it about eight years ago. Long before I created EM. So I know a few things about the subject. You should spend some quality time reading it if you want to learn what the realities are in the real world with non-fictional characters. http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com What say you about this interesting topic? Links: http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Otherkin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otherkin http://community.livejournal.com/otherkin/ http://www.werelist.com/ http://community.livejournal.com/otakin/profile Last but not least an otherkin cult, enjoy: http://www.demon-sushi.com/warning/freejournal.html
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 8:50 pm
Good topic and admittedly difficult for me to tackle. This is due to all of the sub-classifications and person-to-person definitions. Much like when I ask "furries" what being a "furry" actually is, I get told something new every time. Then after I tell a "furry" the definition of "furry" as I been told before hand by another "furry," I am scorned for being wrong.
And much like the furry fandom, otherkin seem to take a large amount of it's material from historical popular culture and current popular culture. Rarely in these internet community formed beliefs to I ever see anything that hasn't already been established long beforehand. But otherkin seem to be unique in the fact that history knows how the myths of dragons, vampires, angels, demons, elves, fairies, lycanthropes, and extra-terrestrials got started. So they must spend an awful lot of time trying to rationalize and legitimize their beliefs to skeptics because of this.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Super Ivan Drago Vice Captain
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 9:54 pm
When Otherkin define themselves as non falsifiable things (having the soul of an animal etc.) I generally shrug it off as being no more or less reasonable or unreasonable than any other religion. When they start claiming things like vampires and actual anthros existing physically, I start blowing the whistle.
It just seems like a catch-all term that encompasses the traditional mythical creatures as well as furries, from what I can tell. I've got nothing against furries and have quite the handful of furry friends who range from total jerks to the nicest, talented people ever, but when I hear otherkin, it just sounds like fleeing from the stigma of the word "furry."
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sat Jun 09, 2007 11:17 pm
My thoughts on the subject, briefly stated, would best be summed up in the classic picture...  My more detailed thoughts would seem that this comes from misinterpretations of reality, a desire to feel important and a healthy persecution complex. Just like the kids who are "bi" to be chic, they want something to b***h about and some excuse to call themselves "different" though their course of action obviates their lack of originality. That and half of 'em would shriek if a wiener touched 'em. I agree with Lykas' statement abbout there being many types of furries, from the horny roleplayer to the sincere fursona to the plushie lovers who have a good bit of psychoemotional stunting (or at least a curiously locus of sexual interest). However, I've met some kickass furries who I'd quickly call good friends. These people...I think they cling to their own delusions or the delusions of others to feel different. But the only way to be different is to be unlike others.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:33 am
Lykus When Otherkin define themselves as non falsifiable things (having the soul of an animal etc.) I generally shrug it off as being no more or less reasonable or unreasonable than any other religion. When they start claiming things like vampires and actual anthros existing physically, I start blowing the whistle. It just seems like a catch-all term that encompasses the traditional mythical creatures as well as furries, from what I can tell. I've got nothing against furries and have quite the handful of furry friends who range from total jerks to the nicest, talented people ever, but when I hear otherkin, it just sounds like fleeing from the stigma of the word "furry." I have furry friends. I don't have to approve of all of my friends hobbies for them to still be my friends. One of them is a commission artist. Sometimes I am amazed at how much she can make after only a few hours of work. Much more than minimum wage. That s**t is exploitative beyond belief. Otherkin, on the other hand, seem to be suffering from classical symptoms of delusions of grandeur. They want acceptance when what they need is treatment.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:59 am
Super Ivan Drago Good topic and admittedly difficult for me to tackle. This is due to all of the sub-classifications and person-to-person definitions. Much like when I ask "furries" what being a "furry" actually is, I get told something new every time. Then after I tell a "furry" the definition of "furry" as I been told before hand by another "furry," I am scorned for being wrong. That sounds about right. Since It's personal beliefs, without a central leadership, it's had to get a concrete definition of the term. Quote: And much like the furry fandom, otherkin seem to take a large amount of it's material from historical popular culture and current popular culture. Rarely in these internet community formed beliefs to I ever see anything that hasn't already been established long beforehand. But otherkin seem to be unique in the fact that history knows how the myths of dragons, vampires, angels, demons, elves, fairies, lycanthropes, and extra-terrestrials got started. So they must spend an awful lot of time trying to rationalize and legitimize their beliefs to skeptics because of this. The rationalizations I run into the most are; string theory, the creatures in question live on the astral plane, the creatures live on other planets in our galaxy and the creature went extinct on earth due to lack of belief in magic or moving to the astral plane. Lykus When Otherkin define themselves as non falsifiable things (having the soul of an animal etc.) I generally shrug it off as being no more or less reasonable or unreasonable than any other religion. When they start claiming things like vampires and actual anthros existing physically, I start blowing the whistle. You get the same range with otherkin, although they tend to tolerate claims of "smaller" magic effects. Quote: It just seems like a catch-all term that encompasses the traditional mythical creatures as well as furries, from what I can tell. I've got nothing against furries and have quite the handful of furry friends who range from total jerks to the nicest, talented people ever, but when I hear otherkin, it just sounds like fleeing from the stigma of the word "furry." I always got the impression that it was more of an offshoot from Wiccan/Pagan groups as well. With Furries it seems that a good number just like anthro animals, with otherkin they believe their souls are that of these creatures. Theophrastus But the only way to be different is to be unlike others. Being of a different species would be a massive difference. Yooonique and special snowflake and all that. My opinion is that otherkin run the gamut from teenagers wanting attention, to the emotionally stunted, to those who honestly accept it as part of their belief system. Let's look at another group, the otakin. They believe they are reincarnations of fictional characters. Nearly every time someone asks how this works they bring up string theory or alternate dimensions (shades of Ninja Turtles). http://otakukin.atspace.com/index.htmThis one believes that he is the reincarnation of a Digimon character.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Super Ivan Drago Vice Captain
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:21 am
Ah... string theory. An interesting topic of discussion but another source of laymen with an agenda justifying pseudoscience and beliefs (but not as bad as the misuse of Quantum Mechanics.) Sometimes I have to keep reminding myself to not blame the science and blame the people who misrepresent it.
EDIT: Afterthought: They ("they" being people who claim to have souls of something non-human) always seem to feel connections to things that they have heard of or seen before. Even after forgiving all of the manipulative rationalizations, it is still beyond reason that all of them would actually have the souls of dragons/animals/anime characters they have all seen before. There are thousands if not millions of mythical creatures/animals/anime characters that have no hold over popular or historical culture. Why never feel any connection to them?
That said, I am still waiting for a spiritual-furry that claims to have the soul of a duck-billed platypus.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:19 am
Super Ivan Drago EDIT: Afterthought: They ("they" being people who claim to have souls of something non-human) always seem to feel connections to things that they have heard of or seen before. Even after forgiving all of the manipulative rationalizations, it is still beyond reason that all of them would actually have the souls of dragons/animals/anime characters they have all seen before. There are thousands if not millions of mythical creatures/animals/anime characters that have no hold over popular or historical culture. Why never feel any connection to them? That said, I am still waiting for a spiritual-furry that claims to have the soul of a duck-billed platypus. Usually they do pick cool animals, however, I have run across a vulture. Is that boring enough?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Super Ivan Drago Vice Captain
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:00 pm
Ilikepie4 Super Ivan Drago EDIT: Afterthought: They ("they" being people who claim to have souls of something non-human) always seem to feel connections to things that they have heard of or seen before. Even after forgiving all of the manipulative rationalizations, it is still beyond reason that all of them would actually have the souls of dragons/animals/anime characters they have all seen before. There are thousands if not millions of mythical creatures/animals/anime characters that have no hold over popular or historical culture. Why never feel any connection to them? That said, I am still waiting for a spiritual-furry that claims to have the soul of a duck-billed platypus. Usually they do pick cool animals, however, I have run across a vulture. Is that boring enough? If it was a Spider-Man villain, then it's not boring. lol Perhaps a Dodo?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 5:27 pm
Ilikepie4 Super Ivan Drago EDIT: Afterthought: They ("they" being people who claim to have souls of something non-human) always seem to feel connections to things that they have heard of or seen before. Even after forgiving all of the manipulative rationalizations, it is still beyond reason that all of them would actually have the souls of dragons/animals/anime characters they have all seen before. There are thousands if not millions of mythical creatures/animals/anime characters that have no hold over popular or historical culture. Why never feel any connection to them? That said, I am still waiting for a spiritual-furry that claims to have the soul of a duck-billed platypus. Usually they do pick cool animals, however, I have run across a vulture. Is that boring enough? Well, it's not as common as dogs and wolves, I'd bet. One of my friends told me that he has an otter 'fursona' and now when I think of him, I think of the adorable picture on wikipedia's Otter article. Um, tangent. Sorry. Anyway, what I was saying is that someone claiming to be a vulture is probably a lot more interesting within the furry community/fandom/whatever than someone being wolf #1995673784.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 6:00 pm
*checks*
Wow, that otter pic on Wikipedia is pretty damn cute.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:49 pm
I wonder how some of these "otherworldly beings" explain what the X-rays at the hospital have to say about their human skeletal structures. Oh wait... they're lying, because they were built by closed-minded, foolish humans.
Sadly, some of these "Otherkin" actually think like this. Now, like most of the people in this guild, I try to respect everyone's right to their own fantasies. But I just have to draw the line when people like the "Otherkin" start looking down at me because I'm too "closed-minded" or "arrogant" to join in on their shenanigans.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Super Ivan Drago Vice Captain
|
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:32 pm
Semper Fiasco I wonder how some of these "otherworldly beings" explain what the X-rays at the hospital have to say about their human skeletal structures. Oh wait... they're lying, because they were built by closed-minded, foolish humans. Sadly, some of these "Otherkin" actually think like this. Now, like most of the people in this guild, I try to respect everyone's right to their own fantasies. But I just have to draw the line when people like the "Otherkin" start looking down at me because I'm too "closed-minded" or "arrogant" to join in on their shenanigans. It's difficult to deal with. Just like anything of the sort, they start at (X) and then they find/manipulate science, logic and reason to rationalize it. And in the process, create a nice little community of wishful thinkers. Well, guys, I have the soul of an Apple-Cinnamon Cheerio. I finally came to this understanding after realizing that I love bathing in milk. I am... a General-Mills-Kin. What? You don't believe me? STRING THEORY SAYS OTHERWISE.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 9:06 pm
From what the Therian was saying he apparently identified with a wolf because of arbitrary traits he compared to exhausted stereotypes.
Also, he thinks when we dream we enter the "astral realm" of souls. What a putz.
It is one thing to blindly believe in something that cannot be proven or disproved. That can be called faith. However believing in something completely disproved by science is silly. He might as well think the earth is flat.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
