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Formerly called the NCS, this is a place for communists and socialists to talk about communism and socialism. 

Tags: Marxism, Communism, Socialism, Political, Left 

Reply MCS: Marxism, Communism, Socialism
Pope blames Marxism, capitalism for problems

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Maryhl

Shy Werewolf

PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 8:07 pm


CNN
Pope blames Marxism, capitalism for problems

APARECIDA, Brazil (AP) -- Pope Benedict XVI blamed Marxism and unbridled capitalism for Latin America's problems on Sunday, and urged bishops to mold a new generation of Roman Catholic leaders in politics to reverse the church's declining influence in the region.

Ending a five-day trip to the church's biggest stronghold on the planet, Benedict also warned that legalized contraception and abortion in Latin America threaten "the future of the peoples" and said the historic Catholic identity of the region is under assault.

Like his predecessor, Pope John Paul II, Benedict criticized capitalism's negative effects and Marxist influences that have motivated some grass-roots Catholic activists, remnants of the Liberation theology he moved to crush when he was a cardinal.

"The Marxist system, where it found its way into government, not only left a sad heritage of economic and ecological destruction, but also a painful destruction of the human spirit," Benedict said as he opened a two-week bishops' conference aimed at re-energizing the church's influence in Latin America.

But he added that unfettered capitalism and globalization, blamed by many in the region for the deep divide between the rich and poor, gives "rise to a worrying degradation of personal dignity through drugs, alcohol and deceptive illusions of happiness."

Benedict, speaking in Spanish and Portuguese to the bishops in Brazil's holiest shrine city, also said Latin America needs more dedicated Catholics in leadership positions in the media and at universities.

"This being a continent of baptized Christians, it is time to overcome the notable absence -- in the political sphere, in the world of the media and in the universities -- of the voices and initiatives of Catholic leaders with strong personalities and generous dedication, who are coherent in their ethical and religious convictions," Benedict said.

He said the church's leaders must halt a trend that has seen millions of Catholics turn into born-again Protestants or simply stop going to church.

"It is true that one can detect a certain weakening of Christian life in society overall," Benedict told 200 bishops and archbishops and 20 cardinals. "And of participation in the life of the Catholic Church, due to secularism, hedonism, indifferentism and proselytism by numerous sects, animist religions and new pseudo-religious phenomena."

In Aparecida and in major events earlier this week in Sao Paulo that attracted more than 1 million people, Benedict roundly denounced immorality in a bid to counter the a rising tide of Latin Americans flouting the church's prohibition on premarital sex and divorce.

Now, he said, the bishops must convince Catholics from all walks of life "to bring the light of the Gospel into public life, into culture, economics and politics."

Benedict didn't name any countries in his criticism of capitalism and Marxism, but Latin America has become deeply divided in recent years amid a sharp political tilt to the left -- with the election of leftist leaders in Bolivia, Ecuador and Nicaragua and the re-election in Venezuela of President Hugo Chavez, an avowed socialist.

Other countries, like Brazil, have center-left leaders who have come under heavy criticism for embracing free market economic policy that critics contend helps only big business and does for the poor.

Benedict called the institution of the family "one of the most important treasures of Latin American countries" but said it is under attack and that "civil legislation opposed to marriage which, by supporting contraception and abortion, is threatening the future of peoples."

Mexico City lawmakers last month approved abortion in a move hotly contested by the church, and Catholic leaders in Brazil constantly assail the government's free handout of millions of condoms to prevent AIDS.

Before addressing the bishops, Benedict oversaw an open-air Sunday Mass before 150,000 faithful jammed into the plaza in front of the mammoth basilica of Aparecida, home to the nation's patron saint, a black Virgin Mary.

As hundreds of choir members sang hymns and the faithful waved flags from all corners of South America, the German-born pope called the region the "continent of hope" and said the bishops must be "courageous and effective missionaries" to ensure the strength of the church.

But the turnout fell far short of the 400,000 to 500,000 worshippers local organizers hoped would show up for Benedict's last big public event of the papal tour, his longest since becoming pope two years ago.

The 80-year-old pope also said the Church needs to worker harder getting its message across on the Internet, radio and television -- methods used effectively in Brazil by Protestant congregations attracting legions of followers, particularly in the vast slums ringing the nation's cities.

While Brazil is home to more than 120 million of the world's 1.1 billion Catholics, the nation's census shows the percentage of citizens characterizing themselves as Catholics plunged to 74 percent in 2000 from 89 percent in 1980. The ranks of those calling themselves evangelical Protestants rose to 15 percent from 7 percent.

Waiting to catch a glimpse of the pope in the shadow of Aparecida's basilica, 68-year-old Maria Costa said Brazilians needed the message from Benedict, and that his trip could revitalize the church.

"Catholics weren't feeling very good with the Church, and that's why so many were leaving," she said. "I think that could change now. Let's hope so."

As the pope headed by helicopter to Sao Paulo to board a plane back to Rome, Colombian bishop Hector Gutierrez said it's no secret that the church is "losing control of the youth" and Benedict helped give the bishops ideas on how to stop the losses.

"We can and we will thrust Latin America forward," Gutierrez said.
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 8:54 pm


******** no, even Europe realized the Papal States was a big ******** and got in the way. That's why they're now just a little chunk of Rome instead of a mess of the Italian pennisula.

Contra mundus


UF6

PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 9:35 pm


Contra mundus
Been playing Medevil II like a good boy? Learning something? the papael states were a joke really, the only reason the Holy roman empire or others diden't crush it, was th fear of pheasant uprising since the pope could ex communicate the king and people would go nuts.

I think a treaty in the late 19th century established today's borders. As for Father ruling us, nah. You need me, I will make sure no body complains, ever.
A science state, sorry but you will all have to die, your not welcome here anymore. Either that or build a rocket ship. You could do it with your mind and dream its there. lol Just joking or am I?

As for ******** economics, if it fails people starve so I wouldn't bash it just change it. If you hate it so much.
PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2007 10:49 pm


I'm not sure what does the pope wants us to follow then, it doesn't matter if our leaders go to church and pray all the time. They will always follow an ideology which is based in capitalism or socialism. But since marx told that religion was the opium of the masses, the pope tells that Marxism is evil.

Handmade Soldier


Monsieur Rosebud

PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 8:42 am


if he's so damn concerned about the rich poor gap, yet capitalism supports big business, and Marxism equalizes it, what the hell does he intend to do? Im sure his Hitler Youth a** could spare a few Pope Bucks to help them out
PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 12:16 pm


Monsieur Rosebud
if he's so damn concerned about the rich poor gap, yet capitalism supports big business, and Marxism equalizes it, what the hell does he intend to do? Im sure his Hitler Youth a** could spare a few Pope Bucks to help them out
Um he was in Muses youth group.

UF6


Fe3No

PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 6:53 pm


Mmmm what we need here is some simple capitalism (Simple not like USA .. thats advanced/ Failing Capitalisms ) with some socialism in the right places and maybe throw in some democratic and communism parts make something new .. cause the problems today need to be solved with ideas from today not yester year


Simple version (Simplify Economy and mix government (Rule style) and make a new ideas based of the old ... )
PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 7:18 pm


Spiffa
Mmmm what we need here is some simple capitalism (Simple not like USA .. thats advanced/ Failing Capitalisms ) with some socialism in the right places and maybe throw in some democratic and communism parts make something new .. cause the problems today need to be solved with ideas from today not yester year


Simple version (Simplify Economy and mix government (Rule style) and make a new ideas based of the old ... )

I hope you also support after mixing them up to progress further....otherwise I disagree completely.

Contra mundus


Maryhl

Shy Werewolf

PostPosted: Thu May 17, 2007 8:08 pm


I'm... not sure he even know what he means.
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2007 5:05 am


Demon Kagerou
I'm... not sure he even know what he means.

How dare you say this of course I know what I mean......mostly....!

Contra mundus


Steve Sage

PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2007 10:19 am


This comes as no suprise becasue the traditionally Catholic church has been a supporter of Corporatism. Corporatism is a system intended to make modern economics act like fedul economics, with gulids and everything. Typcially the Catholic facist countries like Italy and Spain tried out Corporatism, the results were pretty ho-hum.

The Catholic church wants ot be a "Third Way" in the battle between captialist materialism and socialist materialism. But frankly its an old dying insustion
PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2007 4:08 pm


Contra mundus
Demon Kagerou
I'm... not sure he even know what he means.

How dare you say this of course I know what I mean......mostly....!
In the end dose it really matter?

UF6


Lady Merewyn

PostPosted: Sat May 19, 2007 9:43 pm


Meh, the Catholic Church hasn't changed its stance on such since Pope Louis XII wrote his encyclical entitled "Rerum Novarum," Latin for "Of New Things" which dealt with economic issues. Unfortunately, with regards to Marxism, I'm of the opinion that Louis had no real idea what he was talking about when he made his refutations, but was merely defending an old and outdated social order. Then again, that was just my impression having read Rerum Novarum... It basically condemned Marxism and socialism, then threw in a few token words hinting that unbridled capitalism wasn't the answer either, but I thought that afterthought was very utopian, that by merely saying "be respectful" when there would be no motive for capitalists to do so was merely wishful thinking...
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MCS: Marxism, Communism, Socialism

 
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