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razielarcha

PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 9:11 pm


WARNING


Suomi (Finnish) is a non-Indo-European language. Structures, and all that fun stuff are vastly different. So, even if you think that you see a cognate or loan word, double check yourself because it may not be what you think it is.

And since this language is so different, I think we should start with some grammar so that you can start to pick out the different parts of words.

Useful Links

Flashcard program I highly recommend this one. It has sound, pictures, and the ability to download other lists.

Pronunciations and useful links

Interactive site that helps with concepts.

Listening

If you have yet to ever hear Finnish, you may want to listen to any one of these:
jouluyö, joulayö (Silent Night)
kuolema tekee taiteilijan
Kuunpoika (Hijo de la Luna)
Tietäjä
Pidä Kädestä. And yes, I know these are all songs. I'm not trying to get you to memorize lyrics with these. Just try and distinguish between words.

And now that ickky grammar stuff

Nominals

Nominals are Nouns, adjectives, pronouns, numerals, and other such things.

Some examples that will be used in this lesson:

auto (car)
katu (street)
nainen (woman)
hinta (price)

iso (big)
kallis (expensive)
pitkä (long)
vanha (old)

minä (I)
he (they)
tämä (this)
se (it)

yksi (one)
kymmenen (ten)
toinen (second)
seitsemäs (seventh)

the four classes that I just listed take the same endings. Suomi is a language of endings. There are four kinds of endings, and these can be lined, one after another in a word.

Nouns in Suomi can be either singular or plural. Singular words do not have an ending to mark them, but plural words have two endings. In the nominative (basic) form, nouns take the ending -t. In other cases, the words take the ending of -i-. The -i- ending sometimes takes the form of -j- but is considered the same ending.

Suomi English

**I'm going to put a / in between the parts so you can see them. In normal Suomi, this slash does not go there**

auto . . car . . . auto/t . . cars
auto/ssa . . in the car . . . auto/i/ssa . . in the cars
auto/sta . . from the car . . . auto/i/sta . . . from the cars
auto/on . . into the car . . . auto/i/hin . . Into the cars
auto/lla . . by (the) car . . . auto/i/lla . . . by (the) cars

pullo . . bottle . . . pullo/t . . bottles
pullo/sta . . out of the bottle . . . pullo/i/sta . . . out of the bottles
pullo/lla . . with a bottle . . . pullo/i/lla . . with the bottles
pullo/a . . . bottle (partitive) . . pullo/j/a . . . some bottles

Confused yet? Don't worry, you'll get used to it. It's really a very beautiful language.

Cases Suomi has some 15 cases. I'm not going to list them all here and confuse you just yet, but just know that they exist and that each has it's own ending.

Suomi also practices something called vowel harmony. This will make some of the endings take umlauts. Again, I'm not going to confuse you just yet with this, but just know that they exist.

Possessives This is the third ending a Nominal can take. This part says whether it's me, you, or someone(s) else that has or is doing something.

(minun) kirja/ni . . . my book (first person singular)
(sinun) kirja/si . . . your book (second person singular)
hänen kirja/nsa . . . his/her book (third person singular)

(meidän) kirja/mme . . . our book (first person plural)
(teidän) kirja/nne . . . your book (second person plural)
heidän kirja/nsa . . . their book (third person singular)

***Notice, the pronoun for he/she is one in the same.. hän. Suomi doesn't tell the difference in the pronoun form.***

Particles these are the fourth and final ending. I'll get into these later also.

There is a set pattern for these endings. They may all appear at the end of a word, but they can never leave their order.

(word) + number(plural or not) + case + possessive + particle

I'll now start with phrases and words next lesson.
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:06 am


Tervetuloa Welcome

Pronunciation videos because trying to explain them with typing is nearly pointless. Where you are depends on how you pronounce things.

Video 1
Video 2
Saying hello and good-bye

Major vocabulary DumpDon't worry, it will all make sense eventually.

suomi English

Terve
Moro
Hei
Moi
. . . . Hello/hi

Heippa
Moikka
Hei Hei
Moi Moi
. . . . . Bye

Nähdään . . . . See you later.

Hyvästi
Näkemiin
. . . .. Goodbye

Hyvää huomenta
Hyvää aamupäivää
Huomenta
. . . . . . Goodmorning

Hyvää päivää
päivää
. . . . . . . .Good afternoon

Hyvää iltaa
iltaa
. . . . . . . . Good evening

Hyvää yötä
Hyvää öitä
. . . . .. Good night

Hauska tavata . . . . . . .Nice to meet you

Kiitos . . . . . . . Thank you

Kiitos, samoin . . . .. . Thank you, likewise

Kuinka voitte? . . . . . . . How are you?
Mitä kuuluu?.. . . . . . .(informal) how are you?

Kiitos hyvää . . . . . . . I'm fine thank you

Ei hyvää, kittos . . . . . . . Not well, thank you

kyllä . . . . . . .Yes (informal)
joo . . . . . . . .yes (slang)

ei . . . . . . . . no

minä. . . . . .. I
. . . . . . . I (slang)

sinä . . . . . . . You
. . . . . . .. You (slang)

hän. . . . . . . .He/she (no distinction between male and female here)

me . . . . . . .We

te . . . . . . . . .you (plural)

he . .. . . . . . .they

se . . . . . . . . it

Anteeksi . . . . . . sorry/excuse me

En ymmärrä . . . . . . I don't understand

Ymmärrän
Minä ymmärrän
. . . . . . . . I understand

razielarcha


razielarcha

PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:50 pm


Hetki pieni . . . . . .. One moment please

Little note before I forget again... When parts are conjugated, Finns will often times leave off the pronoun. This only works for the minä (I), sinä (you singular), me (we) and te (you plural) forms. hän and he have the same conjugation and so need the pronoun to distinguish between the two.

Numbers

yksi . . . . . . 1 one
kaksi . . . . . . 2 two
kolme . . . .. . 3 three
neljä . . . . . . 4 four
viisi . . . . . . . 5 five
kuusi . . . . . . 6 six
seitsemän . . . . . 7 seven
kahdeksan . . . . 8 eight
yhdeksän . . . . . .9 nine
kymmenen . . . . . 10 ten

(Minä) olen . . . . . I am
mä oon . . . . . . I am (slang)

(sinä) olet . . . . . .you are
sä oot . . . . . . . you are (slang)

hän on . . . . . .. he or she is

se on. . . . . . . . . it is

(me) olemme . . . . . . . we are

(te) olette . . . . . . . . . you (plural) are

he ovat . . . . . . . . . .they (persons) are

ne ovat . . . . . . . . . . they (non-persons) are

Not so bad just yet I hope? Next we'll finally start getting into phrases.

I'll be using an '*' when the following statements are for either formal situations or more than one person.

*Ymmärrätte kö suomea?
Do you understand Finnish?
Ymmärrät kö suomea?
Do you understand Finnish?
(look at the ending of the first words if you didn't notice the differences between the two)

*Puhutteko englantia?
Puhutko englantia?
Do you speak English?

*Oletteko englantilainen?
Oletko englantilainen?
Are you English? (nationality)

*Missä sinä asut?
Missä te assutte?
Where do you live?

Olen..... . . . . . .I'm..... (nationality)
englantilainen. . . . . . .American.
amerikkalainen. . . . . . .English.
australialainen. . . . . . .. Australian.
uusiseelantilainen . . . . . . New Zelander.
irlantilainen. . . . . . . . . . . Irish.
skotlantilainen. . . . . . . . .Scottish.

***Note*** With nationalities, you will take the suomi name for your country and add one of the following endings: (-lainen, -läinen) depending on Vowel harmony. (Next lesson for that)

*Olen kotoisin.... . . . . . . . I'm from (country)
Amerikasta. . . . . . . . America.
Englannista. . . . . . . . England.
Italiasta. . . . . . . . . . Italy.
Saksasta. . . . . . . . . .Germany.

***Note***For the informal way to say what country you're from, leave off the kotoisin. Also, there are two(well, actually four) endings to a country.
YOu take the country name and add either (-sta, -stä, -lta, -ltä). What ending you use depends on the spelling.

(Minä) asun Lincolnssa. . . . . . . I live in Lincoln.
Lincolnssa . . . . . . Lincoln.

***Note***As with the countries, there are different endings. The endings for cities are (-ssa. -ssä, -lla, -llä).

*Mikä on teidän nimmenne?
Mikä on nimesi?
What is your name?

*Nimeni on..... . . . . . . My name is....

***Note, you can also just say:
Olen ... and then your name.
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:53 pm


Yeah i Finish yeacher, im in, and i love finland, i have been treying to get a teacher here were i live, but there are no teachers, and i love to hear finish bands so i know how it sounds.

Ps. Sonata arctica, nightwish and Indica ROCKS!!!

Drakuli

6,300 Points
  • Tycoon 200
  • Full closet 200
  • Money Never Sleeps 200

Drakuli

6,300 Points
  • Tycoon 200
  • Full closet 200
  • Money Never Sleeps 200
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:15 pm


Quote:
(minun) kirja/ni . . . my book (first person singular)
(sinun) kirja/si . . . your book (second person singular)
hänen kirja/nsa . . . his/her book (third person singular)

(meidän) kirja/mme . . . our book (first person plural)
(teidän) kirja/nne . . . your book (second person plural)
heidän kirja/nsa . . . their book (third person singular)


I have a question here. The ones in parentheses are something you add or what?, So if you could explain it to me please.
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:23 pm


Drakuli
Quote:
(minun) kirja/ni . . . my book (first person singular)
(sinun) kirja/si . . . your book (second person singular)
hänen kirja/nsa . . . his/her book (third person singular)

(meidän) kirja/mme . . . our book (first person plural)
(teidän) kirja/nne . . . your book (second person plural)
heidän kirja/nsa . . . their book (third person singular)


I have a question here. The ones in parentheses are something you add or what?, So if you could explain it to me please.


The ones in the parentheses can be there or you can leave them out. Since the conjugated form shows who/what you're talking about, Finns tend to leave them off.

So, saying Minun kirjani is correct and saying just kirjani is correct.

razielarcha


Drakuli

6,300 Points
  • Tycoon 200
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  • Money Never Sleeps 200
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:35 pm


razielarcha
Drakuli
Quote:
(minun) kirja/ni . . . my book (first person singular)
(sinun) kirja/si . . . your book (second person singular)
hänen kirja/nsa . . . his/her book (third person singular)

(meidän) kirja/mme . . . our book (first person plural)
(teidän) kirja/nne . . . your book (second person plural)
heidän kirja/nsa . . . their book (third person singular)


I have a question here. The ones in parentheses are something you add or what?, So if you could explain it to me please.


The ones in the parentheses can be there or you can leave them out. Since the conjugated form shows who/what you're talking about, Finns tend to leave them off.

So, saying Minun kirjani is correct and saying just kirjani is correct.


Oh ok thanks.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2009 7:37 pm


Sorry for anyone waiting for the next Suomi lesson. I'll try and put one up tomorrow... I'm in the middle of finals week and I work in retail... I'm hardly ever home!

...And this will also be posted in the Norsk thread..  

razielarcha


razielarcha

PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2009 11:23 am


Vowel Harmony

**These are not clear cut rules. As in any language, there will be exceptions**

Suomi has three types of vowels.

Front (hard) vowels:
ä
ö
y


Neutral vowels:
e
i

and soft (back) vowels:
a
o
u


Single words cannot contain both hard and soft vowels. The only exception to this would be compound words,
(aaltoieva (surging/rolling/swaying) äidillä (mother) työmaata (workplace)
and a very select few words of foreign origin. (amatööri [amateur] amatöörina [as an amateur])

Words can contain both neutral and soft or neutral and hard, but not hard and soft.

When words only contain neutral vowels, their suffixes can only use front (hard) vowels.

Cases

These attach to the back of a word.

Case name . . . .ending . . . function . . . example (translation)
Nominative -(pl. -t (basic form) auto ( car)
Genitive -nö -den, -tten possession auton (of the car )
Accusative -n, -t object ending hänet (him/her )
partitive -a/-ä; indefinite maitoa ((some) milk )
---------- -ta/-tä quantity vettä ((some) water )
---------- -tta/-ttä -------- perhettä ((some) family )
Inessive -ssa/-ssä inside autossa ( in the car)
elative -sta/-stä out of autosta ( out of the car)
Illative **note below** -Vn, hVn into autoon (into the car )
------------------- -seen, -siin ---- maahan (into the country )
------------------- --------- ---- Porvooseen (to Porvoo )
Adessive -lla/-llä on/instrument pöydällä (on the table )
Ablative -lta/-ltä off pöydältä (off the table )
Allative -lle onto pöydälle (onto the table )
essive -na/-nä state opettajana (as a teacher )
translative -ksi change of state opettajaksi ((become) a teacher )
comitative -ine- accompanying vaimoineni (with my wife )
instructive -n (idiomatic) jalan (on foot )

**Note** above, in the examples -Vn, -hVn the capital V is meant to indicate the nearest preceding vowel.
so, some examples of this:
Turku would use -un because the nearest vowel to the ending is u and becomes Turkuun (it means to Turku)
Helsinki would use -in because the nearest vowel is i and becomes Helsinkiin (to Helsinki)
maa uses -han and becomes maahan (into the country)
tie uses -hen and becomes tiehen (to the road)

I'll get into particles next time... and maybe a little bit of sentence structure!

Now for a hardcore exercise. I'll not be giving a translation to this. Curl up with a good dictionary and see if you can translate what it says! This is an exert from Lukukirja. It's a book to help children learn to read (and write) Finnish.

Liisa, Maija ja Matti asuvat maalla. He rakastavat suuresti kotiaan. He rakastavat myöskin äitiä, isää ja toinen toisiaan. Heidän kotinsa on hyvin onnellinen.

Talvi-illoin, kun ulkona tuulee ja tuiskuaa, he istuvat loimuavan takkavalkean ääressä ja laulavat kauniita lauluja, joita ovat koulussa oppineet. Raikkaana kaikuu: "On pyhäkoulu armas", ja "On koti, jossa ikilaulu soipi".
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 9:54 am


Finnish audio
To help you with listening comprehension and maybe a bit of pronunciation.

**Why are they all interviews with Finnish bands?** They're not ALL interviews... there's a few tv show cameos in there too xp Celebrity stuff is just easier to find.

one

two

three

four

five

six

seven

eight

nine

ten

eleven

twelve

razielarcha


razielarcha

PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 8:29 pm


Ikky Grammar Stuff

Enclitic particles
This is the fourth and final group of endings for Nominals. These endings can also attach to verbs.

The most popular particle endings are:
-kin . . . . . . . also
-kann/-känn . . . . . . . (not..)either....
-ko/-kö . . . . . .. interrogative (makes it a question)
-han/-hän . . . . . . . emphasis
-pa/-pä . . . . . . .. . emphasis

Difference between -han and -pa

Both these words are basically an emphasis, but they do have two different meanings.

-han is more along the lines of 'I assume you know' (But it's expensive, isn't it?) and often has politeness attached to it in meaning... usually corresponding to the English word please. (But only sometimes!)

-pa is more an emphasis in suprise (Oh, it IS expensive!)

-ko and making questions

When speaking suomi, there is never a change in intonation. The way you pronounce the sentence will not make it a sentence. That is solely done by the use of -ko. This ending can be connected to verbs, adjectives, nouns, or pronouns...

Olen . . .I am
Olenko? . . . . I am?

Olet . . . .You are
Oletko? . . . . you are?


En ole . . . I am not
Enkö ole? . . . . Am I not?

Et ole . . . . you are not
Etkö ole? . . . . . are you not?


Pekka ----> Pekkako? (do you mean Pekka?)

suomalainen -----> Suomalainen? (Finnish? is it Finnish? Do you mean it is Finnish?)

Tämä -----> Tämäkö? (do you mean this one?)

Hän on ------> Hänko on? (is it him/her?)

Finnish Names
Since suomi is non-gender discriminative, you have to tell who or what is female and male based on name and actual definition. Study these. This is a list of male and female Finnish names.

Naisten nimiä . . . .Women's names
Anneli
Anna
Annikki
Auli
Hannele
Hanna
Helena
Johanna
Kaarina
Kirsti
Liisa
Marja
Marjatta
Minna
Sari
Sanna
Kati
Anne
Satu
Tiina
Kirsi
Anu
Laura
Elina
Suvi
Ritva
Riitta
Eija
Tuula
Mirja


Miesten nimiä . . . Men's names
Antero
Antti
Esa
Ilpo
Juhani
Jussi
Kalevi
Matti
Olli
Pekka
Tapani
Tapio
Mika
Marko
Mikko
Janne
Sami
Jari
Petri
Jani
Timo
Pasi
Kari
Teemu
Juha
Jukka
Risto
Markku
Seppo
Heikki
PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 8:43 pm


Is it okay to post in this thread? Because if it is, I just wanted to say thanks for making this thread.
I personally have been learning Finnish once a summer for nearly ten years, but I only started learning intensively for about four years.
I love Finnish, and never have time or people to speak it with during the year, except for old people in town who speak the old fashioned finnish and not the up-to-date kind, which is the kind I can speak. xP
This is great!

Valid Tomfoolery


razielarcha

PostPosted: Sun Dec 20, 2009 9:02 pm


Valid Tomfoolery
Is it okay to post in this thread? Because if it is, I just wanted to say thanks for making this thread.
I personally have been learning Finnish once a summer for nearly ten years, but I only started learning intensively for about four years.
I love Finnish, and never have time or people to speak it with during the year, except for old people in town who speak the old fashioned finnish and not the up-to-date kind, which is the kind I can speak. xP
This is great!


Of course it's fine. And thanks! Feel free to help me should I make any mistakes.
PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 6:35 pm


What you have here is a wonderful start for people to learn Finnish! I can only see small things, and by all means none are huge, and most are correct and only kind of formal. Like nimeni and nimesi, etc. Some people would just say nimi. No big. :]
And the only real thing I can see that is completely understandable and a common mistake is missing the "KPT" changes and not cutting out one letter in a word with double letters when conjugated.
You're doing a brilliant job.
Where did you learn finnish?

Valid Tomfoolery


razielarcha

PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2009 9:21 pm


Valid Tomfoolery
What you have here is a wonderful start for people to learn Finnish! I can only see small things, and by all means none are huge, and most are correct and only kind of formal. Like nimeni and nimesi, etc. Some people would just say nimi. No big. :]
And the only real thing I can see that is completely understandable and a common mistake is missing the "KPT" changes and not cutting out one letter in a word with double letters when conjugated.
You're doing a brilliant job.
Where did you learn finnish?


xd I'm still learning Finnish. Most of what is here is me mixing and matching from my respective books to make it understandable. I have a friend in Finland, but I never try to practice my Finnish with her because I'm still a noob at it.

Yeah.. if you see something wrong, either I copied it wrong, or my book has a typo.
Reply
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