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 Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:11 am
Quote: To worship is to give profound reverence, respect and love to a Divine Being; to give praise and honor, to recognize the omnipotence and the divine qualities of deity; to be cognizant of divine grace, love and concern; and to be desirous or maintaining a closeness, a personal relationship and and an ongoing communication. This passage is taken from the book titled "Answering Challenging Mormon Questions" By Michael W. Hickenbotham What are your thoughts on this passage?
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Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:23 am
So if worship means to give extreme reverence to God, wouldn't shouting halleujah(sp?), playing loud music in Church, shouting, raising your hands be considered irreverent?
The Holy Ghost speaks to us in a small still voice, how can you hear Him speak to you if you are singing loudly and waving your hands all over?
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Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 7:13 pm
well im guessing theres different forms of worship.. remember david danced almost naked in front of the ark for God , his wife Michale got pretty ticked off for it .. and because she was so mad she was cursed to never have children again
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Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2009 9:02 pm
Shadows-shine So if worship means to give extreme reverence to God, wouldn't shouting halleujah(sp?), playing loud music in Church, shouting, raising your hands be considered irreverent? The Holy Ghost speaks to us in a small still voice, how can you hear Him speak to you if you are singing loudly and waving your hands all over? You have to remember it depends on the denomination. My church does a lot of that hand waving, dancing, and praising jazz, and visiting speakers usually remark on how close our church seems to the Lord. The time I felt the Lord's presence most was when I was last dancing. The Mormon definition doesn't really seem to apply.
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:03 am
xxEternallyBluexx Shadows-shine So if worship means to give extreme reverence to God, wouldn't shouting halleujah(sp?), playing loud music in Church, shouting, raising your hands be considered irreverent? The Holy Ghost speaks to us in a small still voice, how can you hear Him speak to you if you are singing loudly and waving your hands all over? You have to remember it depends on the denomination. My church does a lot of that hand waving, dancing, and praising jazz, and visiting speakers usually remark on how close our church seems to the Lord. The time I felt the Lord's presence most was when I was last dancing. The Mormon definition doesn't really seem to apply. That's not the Mormon definition of Worship. That's what worship truly is. I just pulled that quote from a book. How can you know you felt the Spirit while dancing? Are you sure it wasn't some adrenaline rush? (I'm not denying you personal experience...I'm just asking questions) Because every one I know, protestants included, have never truly felt the spirit unless they were still, silent, and in prayer.
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:04 am
LordTalisEraphen well im guessing theres different forms of worship.. remember david danced almost naked in front of the ark for God , his wife Michale got pretty ticked off for it .. and because she was so mad she was cursed to never have children again Could you cite the verse where this is at, please?
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:44 pm
Shadows-shine So if worship means to give extreme reverence to God, wouldn't shouting halleujah(sp?), playing loud music in Church, shouting, raising your hands be considered irreverent? The Holy Ghost speaks to us in a small still voice, how can you hear Him speak to you if you are singing loudly and waving your hands all over? Shouting halleujah, playing loud music in Church, raising your hands and dancing is praising the Lord and some people actually get that excited about the Lord. During the celebration/worship, GOD's SPIRIT can be felt. Touching can be considered a form of communication. After the celebration when you are still and quiet he can speak to you in a small still voice. smile He speaks to us through scripture, songs, worship, durning prayer and other people. We have to learn how to recognize his voice and methods. John 10:27 My sheep listen to my voice; I know them and they follow me. John 10:14 I am the good shepherd I know my sheep and my sheep know me 1Chronicles 28:9b For the LORD searches every heart and understands every motive behind the thoughts If you seek him he will be found by YOU.
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:51 pm
Wouldn't shouting be irreverent though?
In my Church, when we enter the chapel, we are asked to talk in hushed voices to keep the spirit of reverence in the room. The organist is playing the prelude hymn softly while every takes their seats.
In the Temple, it's a peaceful quietness all throughout. People are whispering, in the Chapel, we sing hymns of worship and say our prayers before we go to work. It's busy, but quiet and peaceful.
I don't doubt God does speak to people through scriptures and music, etc. But how can one hear Him if the music is blaring, people are shouting and jumping up and down? I thought the Bible taught that we should go to a quiet, secluded place to pray? Wouldn't the reason for that be because it better helps us hear the Spirit whisper to us?
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 1:59 pm
Reverence:
fear: a feeling of profound respect for someone or something; "the fear of God"; "the Chinese reverence for the dead"; "the French treat food with ...
a reverent mental attitude
regard with feelings of respect and reverence; consider hallowed or exalted or be in awe of; "Fear God as your father"; "We venerate genius"
an act showing respect (especially a bow or curtsy)
Profound:
showing intellectual penetration or emotional depth; "the differences are profound"; "a profound insight"; "a profound book"; "a profound mind ...
fundamental: far-reaching and thoroughgoing in effect especially on the nature of something; "the fundamental revolution in human values that has occurred"; "the book underwent fundamental changes"; "committed the fundamental error of confusing spending with extravagance"; "profound social ...
coming from deep within one; "a profound sigh"
heavy: (of sleep) deep and complete; "a heavy sleep"; "fell into a profound sleep"; "a sound sleeper"; "deep wakeless sleep"
situated at or extending to great depth; too deep to have been sounded or plumbed; "the profound depths of the sea"; "the dark unfathomed caves of ocean"-Thomas Gray; "unplumbed depths of the sea"; "remote and unsounded caverns"
Respect:
(usually preceded by `in') a detail or point; "it differs in that respect"
esteem: the condition of being honored (esteemed or respected or well regarded); "it is held in esteem"; "a man who has earned high regard"
an attitude of admiration or esteem; "she lost all respect for him"
deference: a courteous [removed](by word or deed) of esteem or regard; "his deference to her wishes was very flattering"; "be sure to give my respects to the dean"
obedience: behavior intended to please your parents; "their children were never very strong on obedience"; "he went to law school out of respect for his father's wishes"
regard highly; think much of; "I respect his judgement"; "We prize his creativity"
regard: a feeling of friendship and esteem; "she mistook his manly regard for love"; "he inspires respect"
show respect towards; "honor your parents!"
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:00 pm
Shadows-shine Wouldn't shouting be irreverent though? In my Church, when we enter the chapel, we are asked to talk in hushed voices to keep the spirit of reverence in the room. The organist is playing the prelude hymn softly while every takes their seats. In the Temple, it's a peaceful quietness all throughout. People are whispering, in the Chapel, we sing hymns of worship and say our prayers before we go to work. It's busy, but quiet and peaceful. I don't doubt God does speak to people through scriptures and music, etc. But how can one hear Him if the music is blaring, people are shouting and jumping up and down? I thought the Bible taught that we should go to a quiet, secluded place to pray? Wouldn't the reason for that be because it better helps us hear the Spirit whisper to us? If that is what you desire, to hear a whisper then that would be your method. However when you seek or petition an answer from GOD I think he is the one that will choose how he answers, and it might not be the way we want it. I guess what I'm trying to say is the important thing is that we receive an answer. Example: I was stressed out one day, came home from work told the LORD I was tired and wanted a vacation and specifically ask to see my homeland. Three days later I got a call from a long time friend I had not heard from in over 15 years. Durning the conversation I asked what made her think of me? She said she was going to Africa for her employer (us gov.} and for some reason she thought about me she did'nt exactly know why. The money, passport, babysitter (none of these things planned) came to pass. That was my answer and it came in action. My prayer was answered and I did shout and dance in celebration without music. wink r
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:00 pm
Based on these definitions of these words, which are used in some form in what worship really is, I feel they require us to be quiet, calm, still, and in prayer.
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 2:03 pm
quietstorm 2 Shadows-shine Wouldn't shouting be irreverent though? In my Church, when we enter the chapel, we are asked to talk in hushed voices to keep the spirit of reverence in the room. The organist is playing the prelude hymn softly while every takes their seats. In the Temple, it's a peaceful quietness all throughout. People are whispering, in the Chapel, we sing hymns of worship and say our prayers before we go to work. It's busy, but quiet and peaceful. I don't doubt God does speak to people through scriptures and music, etc. But how can one hear Him if the music is blaring, people are shouting and jumping up and down? I thought the Bible taught that we should go to a quiet, secluded place to pray? Wouldn't the reason for that be because it better helps us hear the Spirit whisper to us? If that is what you desire, to hear a whisper then that would be your method. However when you seek or petition an answer from GOD I think he is the one that will choose how he answers, and it might not be the way we want it. I guess what I'm trying to say is the important thing is we receive an answer. Of course, I know we all can receieve answers to our prayers. But what I am saying is that from what I've read in the Scriptures, God has usually answered in a small voice, whispering to us, softly. Very rarely do you hear of a loud thunderous voice come booming through the halls of your home or church.
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:34 pm
definition of sanctuary:
1.
a. A sacred place, such as a church, temple, or mosque.
b. The holiest part of a sacred place, as the part of a Christian church around the altar.
2.
a. A sacred place, such as a church, in which fugitives formerly were immune to arrest.
b. Immunity to arrest afforded by a sanctuary.
3. A place of refuge or asylum.
definition of chapel:
a. A place of worship that is smaller than and subordinate to a church.
b. A place of worship in an institution, such as a prison, college, or hospital.
c. A recess or room in a church set apart for special or small services.
d. A place of worship for those not belonging to an established church.
e. The services held at a chapel: Students attend chapel each morning.
definition of worship:
a. The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object
To me personally, I cannot feel reverence towards my Heavenly Father when people are prancing around shouting and making a big show of how much they "love" their Heavenly Father. To me, that is irreverent. When we are in Holy places, are we to act like how the world is, by having a large rock band, shouting at the top of our lungs, trying to make a show, or should be humble, soft and contrite? Was Jesus Himself, the Master of our souls, loud, boisterous, and often annoying? Or was He soft, humble, and asked simply from us?
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:06 pm
Shadows-shine xxEternallyBluexx Shadows-shine So if worship means to give extreme reverence to God, wouldn't shouting halleujah(sp?), playing loud music in Church, shouting, raising your hands be considered irreverent? The Holy Ghost speaks to us in a small still voice, how can you hear Him speak to you if you are singing loudly and waving your hands all over? You have to remember it depends on the denomination. My church does a lot of that hand waving, dancing, and praising jazz, and visiting speakers usually remark on how close our church seems to the Lord. The time I felt the Lord's presence most was when I was last dancing. The Mormon definition doesn't really seem to apply. That's not the Mormon definition of Worship. That's what worship truly is. I just pulled that quote from a book. How can you know you felt the Spirit while dancing? Are you sure it wasn't some adrenaline rush? (I'm not denying you personal experience...I'm just asking questions) Because every one I know, protestants included, have never truly felt the spirit unless they were still, silent, and in prayer. It came from a Mormon book, therefore it is a Mormon definition. wink And how can you know that the Lord is speaking to you, and it's not your own thoughts? The way I knew was He showed me how the universe, all the natural world, and we Christians too were engaged in worshipping Him. My dancing for Him was a small part of a great universe of worship Him. I think He wants our hearts more then our reverence. And don't I count as part of everyone? You saying that is kinda like me saying everyone I know understands the Trinity to be a central teaching of Christianity. And you gotta remember there's a time for peace and 'reverence', and a time for joy. You have to balence the two and let Him show you the good sides to both. And just one more thing: both John Eldredge and CS Lewis have both called our Lord a 'Wild God'. He created this whole wild world remember. It's probrably a bit like nature: you have beautiful peaceful places, and you have other wild, exciting places. He has more then one side to Him, don't you see?
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Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2009 4:08 pm
Someoneiknow definition of sanctuary: 1. a. A sacred place, such as a church, temple, or mosque. b. The holiest part of a sacred place, as the part of a Christian church around the altar. 2. a. A sacred place, such as a church, in which fugitives formerly were immune to arrest. b. Immunity to arrest afforded by a sanctuary. 3. A place of refuge or asylum. definition of chapel: a. A place of worship that is smaller than and subordinate to a church. b. A place of worship in an institution, such as a prison, college, or hospital. c. A recess or room in a church set apart for special or small services. d. A place of worship for those not belonging to an established church. e. The services held at a chapel: Students attend chapel each morning. definition of worship: a. The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object To me personally, I cannot feel reverence towards my Heavenly Father when people are prancing around shouting and making a big show of how much they "love" their Heavenly Father. To me, that is irreverent. When we are in Holy places, are we to act like how the world is, by having a large rock band, shouting at the top of our lungs, trying to make a show, or should be humble, soft and contrite? Was Jesus Himself, the Master of our souls, loud, boisterous, and often annoying? Or was He soft, humble, and asked simply from us? I respect EVERYONE's pesonal feelings concerning the quietness in worship and prayer. I don't paticular care for the loud rock bands either, but if thats what it takes for them and it pleases GOD then thats a good thing. Personally I believe I can receive GOD any way he present himself and I'll reverence him. When his Spirit is present in a crowd I enjoy the spirit, still being aware of whats around me but not allowing the noise to stop his flow within me, but thats just how hungry I am for His presence. So far I've been able to avoid anything that would block it and it's been good for me, Just as He's been good to me.
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