Welcome to Gaia! ::

The Marxist, Communist, and Socialist Guild

Back to Guilds

Formerly called the NCS, this is a place for communists and socialists to talk about communism and socialism. 

Tags: Marxism, Communism, Socialism, Political, Left 

Reply MCS: Marxism, Communism, Socialism
Thoughts on Food and Consumer Items.

Quick Reply

Enter both words below, separated by a space:

Can't read the text? Click here

Submit

Gallenger

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 10:50 am


(Writing the the Marxist leaning tendencies in the guild specifically)

Perhaps you've heard the infantile criticism of socialists and progressives that we're hypocritical for opposing capitalism, but refuse to move into private communes; thus participating the capitalist economy. While such a criticism is pointless, and self evidently so, I have run into some questions on a similiar line.

Should Communists especially, and other left-wing types be concerned about what products they consume? It is inevitable, whenever one makes a purchase (unless it's from a workers' cooperative, socialist state enterprise, or charity organization) that one's money will be transferred to a member of the bourgeoisie or the petty bourgeoisie. Should we acknowledge that there are differences amongst certain bourgeois entities and abstain from their products or advocate against them, while purchasing the products of other bourgeois (or petty-bourgeois) entities due to necessity? Is it pointless to pursue because of the class nature of society? In so far that the "lesser of two evils" that we choose to purchase from could foreseeably take up the cup that will be left by the bourgeois we chose to avoid and become just as damaging to the proletariat and planet? Is funding a local petty-bourgeois type damaging to our overall mission because it could raise them to a point where they would begin exploiting labor to increase profit; or allow for the survival of petty-bourgeois elements which are so precarious given the class nature of society.

To what extent should we be concerned with the environmental policy of various entities (if at all) and how much emphasis should we place on sustainability? Obviously, I like the Cuban people, believe that socialism represents not only a society that smashes the oppression of the proletariat, but also provides for a more sustainable economy; more in line with the needs and mechanisms of the planet at large. And that aside from the inevitability of nuclear holocaust, cataclysmic imperialist wars, and super-exploitation of the "developing" world, socialism represents a necessity for humans because of the environmental crisis which capitalism has created. Socialist ties and economy prevent war, exploitation, and cataclysm of various types, and the planning mechanism provides for sustainable development in a way which capitalism cannot.

Just some questions.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 11:39 am


I often here criticism for purchasing consumer goods. I recall a time I was on campus and wanted a pack of gum. So I went down to the nearby Honey Farms to purchase one. At the counter I opened my wallet revealing a hammer and sickle pin i picked up from the RCP. The cashier looked at me and asked

"Are you a communist?"

"Marxist-Leninist" I replied.

"And yet your buying this pack of gum? Participating in the capitalist economy?"

"Would you have preferred that I stole the gum?"

"Yes, I would have"

So I proceeded to take the gum off the counter and walked out the door without paying.

It is impossible for us to not participate in the capitalist economy. As it is said in the OP, we are inevitably giving our money to the petty-bourgeoisie and the bourgeoisie. Capitalism is the system where the purchase of commodities is its backbone, an economic relation that compels all of us to participate in order to survive. Essentially, even if we did move into communes, the property in which it would be founded upon would have to be purchased from a bourgeois. The only way to do away with this compulsion is to change the economic relations itself. In other words, to replace the capitalist economy with a socialist one. In the mean time, we just have to bite the bullet.

Intermundia


Le Pere Duchesne
Captain

Beloved Prophet

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:14 pm


The only way to do away with capitalism is to overthrow it. In addition, not buying something because the workers were more exploited than the workers somewhere else reeks of 'buy American', 'English Jobs for English Workers' and 'Buy Australian' chauvinism.

Rather than deprive those workers, especially the highly combative Chinese proletariat, of jobs, I would think that 'socialists' would be more interested in maintaining their jobs, and encouraging the growth of those companies, so as to spur the growth of the proletariat in these semi-/neo-/colonial countries.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:34 pm


No matter what you do, if you live in a capitalist system, there's no way to avoid it. If you want to live you have to participate in it.

Most people give the argument, "Well, if you don't want to buy the food, why don't you just grow it yourself?" The problem with that is you still will have to purchase the seeds, sprouts, or animals from the petty-bourgeois or the bourgeois (unless you're lucky enough to have someone give you the stuff). Still, the land that you need to grow your own food, you will still have to buy from some source (unless given the same circumstance above).

You can't dodge a capitalist society if you happen to be living in one, and it's a very sad truth.
Hope for revolution.

Miza_Radioaktiv
Vice Captain

Questionable Prophet

6,450 Points
  • Peoplewatcher 100
  • Forum Explorer 100
  • Conversationalist 100

King To Be Hailed

PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 7:41 pm


Capitalism is the most productive economic system of all time. It is a marked improvement from feudalism, and has created the most economic justice of all time as well (save for primitive communism). Despite someone believing there might be a superior means of economic enrichment of society, they still, due to the principles of capitalism, have the right to take part in the process. A communist may just want to limit their consumerism, and purchase from more worker-friendly sources. That's what I do, anyways.
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:59 am


Marx himself, like a lot of other communist members of the bourgeoisie or petty borgeoisie, struggled with this question in his own life, and even he never figured it out.

One solution is, obviously, to shoplift or otherwise steal, but that doesn't really make a difference because the store has already paid for it, & the money has already gone to the exploiting factory owners (or whoever). Plus, the risk of being caught is often too great to warrant the theft, that is if you could afford to have simply bought the item instead of trying to steal it.

So... I don't know? The only final solution is revolution, but as to what we should do in the meantime... of course, capitalism being inescapable is one of the reasons it needs to be overthrown.

Mister Wilde


Gallenger

PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2009 9:24 pm


I for one do my best not to patronize businesses which are rampantly anti-worker, or to exchange goods as often as possible rather than cash. For example, I've helped a few local growers with gardening stuff in exchange for food (which is normally expensive). Simply weeding for a few hours could provide me with enough food to eat for a week.

I also have tried to live more simply (walking when possible - with my voice recordings of various Marxist-Leninist works biggrin ) doing less costly things for entertainment etc. IN this way I retain as much of myself as possible without growing or participating in the system as much as I can.
PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:33 am


Bit Torrent....c.c

I use vuze and yes I think that every communist party should support legal and more importantly illegal bit torrenting.

Hell China just came out with a show that merges Pokemon Digimon and Naurto...im not joking lol

SoViEtTaNkT34
Crew

Reply
MCS: Marxism, Communism, Socialism

 
Manage Your Items
Other Stuff
Get GCash
Offers
Get Items
More Items
Where Everyone Hangs Out
Other Community Areas
Virtual Spaces
Fun Stuff
Gaia's Games
Mini-Games
//
//

// //

Have an account? Login Now!

//
//