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Heavenly Floetic Sins Crew
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 Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:59 am
Alright. So I've gotten a complaint from Ezru_the_fang about the fight that he was currently participating in. I know what you all are thinking: "Yomiko. What the hell!?" But hear me out. I'm getting to my point. His complaint::Ezru_the_Fang 7th Squad Captain...He thinks he's on par with a Vasto Lorde-class Espada. =_= He's, in essence, modding. He also thinks a captain class would be able to take on a Vasto Lorde without any problem. Single Captain. Versus Vasto Lorde. =_= Ezru_the_Fang I'll trust ya but let me just find this... hold up cuarta Espada in Aizen's army, meaning his abilities are fourth amongst all of the Arrancar and Hollow under Aizen's command. His might is great enough that even in his sealed form he can with a single hand deflect Kisuke's crimson blast, fight on even ground with a full strength Ichigo while in Bankai form, and withstand most of the impact from a black Getsuga Tenshō. It was revealed that Ulquiorra has a second state after his Resurrección, called Segunda Etapa, that supposedly even Aizen himself is unaware of. This could possibly make him equal to or even stronger than the top three Espada in strength. that is powerful partially based on.... http://bleach.wikia.com/wiki/Ulquiorra_Cifer
...and should we have a ranking system? [Non-Stat based]
>_> I'm sorreh, but I'm not really up-to-date with my bleach.
=_= few more chapters... to go...
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:52 am
Well, in Bleach, it has been stated multiple times that the Tenth Espada is Captain-Level. Therefore, the Cuarta would be above Captain-level, compared to an average Captain in any case.
Therefore, a Captain would at least have quite a bit of trouble defeating the Cuarta, if not be unable to defeat said Espada.
Now... I'mnot sure how it is in the guild, but I think its important to consider how things are in Bleach.
If we were going to have some sort of ranking system, I would say that up to Septima, a Captain, though with some trouble, would be able to defeat them. After Septima, it would take perhaps a Captain- and Lieutenant-class shinigami to take one down up until Cuarta. Above Cuarta, it would take two Captain-class shinigami, and possibly not even then.
But all of that is only my opinion... Though, having a chara on both sides makes me a little less biased than some others.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 8:06 am
Well I don't know if Ulquiorra is really a good example, since if you really saw what he does to the presumed "Cero Espada" Yammi is pretty much Ulquiorra's b***h >> And since he HAS the Second Release, and it hasn't been seen yet that the others, Tercera, Segunda, Primera and Cero one would have to assume that Ulquiorra is much more powerful then them based on current information. So like I said, Ulquiorra, even with his "rank" is really a poor example, it's almost like using Ichigo as an example for a regular Shinigami or Vaizard, though there are still the same basically, there is clearly a power difference.
I'm am going to have to say though, that since it did take a Vice and a Captain to defeat the Segunda Espada in the series and it only took Hitsuguya to defeat the Tercera: Halibel. Even though they are clearly NOT defeated as revealed by a recent chapter. So Winged's opinion would probobly be one to listen too. Ulquiorra and Ichigo are so far exceptions, not the rules, same thing would go with Kenpachi and Nnoitra, Kenpachi doesn't even have Bankai let alone Shikai, and he defeated Nnoitra, even though there was an interruption by Nel-tu, Kenpachi took on Nnoitra in his ressereccion.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 10:53 am
´ˇºˆ°º¤·˙·|·˙·¤º°ˆºˇ´
As Colm stated, Ulquiorra is not a good example. I would say just like Ichigo and Rukia he is an exception to the rule, not the standard for the rule.
I say it would not be easy by any means for a Captain to take down the 4th espada. I would put it at an even match personally.
It all depends on one another's strength's and weaknesses.
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[R]eflections Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:27 pm
But it has been noted in the anime that the 10th Espada is Captain Level, (Considering that Yammy ended up being the Cero, I'm not sure what effect taht has on it, but I'm pretty sure it refers to pre-resurreccion) so if we make it so that the Cuarta can be taken down by a single Captain (no matter how much trouble one has), wouldn't that be a serious case of power degeneration for the Quinta-Decima?
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 12:46 pm
´ˇºˆ°º¤·˙·|·˙·¤º°ˆºˇ´
No it wouldn't be a serious degeneration in power. Not all Captain's are even at the same power level, there are weak and highly powerful captains when compared to one another. So naturally there is going to be a Captain to match up to an Espada no matter the spot.
At least this is my personal opinion.
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[R]eflections Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:00 pm
These things are really hard to say for sure. As the points have been made I can't say much, but I can say this, any manner of who is more powerful then whom outside of the captain commander will get very...sticky.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:49 pm
Well, I don't know if we should even speak of Cero Espada, since that fight with Yammi in that form hasn't progressed at all, and I honestly think Yammi is a liar and that his tattoo changes with how much power he has AT THE TIME. Why? Because when he said: I've been resting and eating to store up energy Besides like I said, Yammi definately isn't the most powerful, again he WAS Ulquiorra's b***h, no denying that. ALSO when Yammi fought Hitsuguya during the Shinigami's little zanpaku-to communication session, he said "What do you know?! I'm a 10 too!"
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[R]eflections Vice Captain
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 2:39 pm
´ˇºˆ°º¤·˙·|·˙·¤º°ˆºˇ´
Also in the matter, so far the Espada has only been using Cero's.
His opponents specialty is using alternate dimensions, so countering them by storing them in a dimension as is his ability is not god-moding in my opinion.
Personally I say it is just the persons idiocy to play into his opponents strength and then complain about it.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 3:07 pm
´ˇºˆ°º¤·˙·|·˙·¤º°ˆºˇ´
Yomi has said my previous post also voices her opinion on the matter.
xd
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[R]eflections Vice Captain
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Heavenly Floetic Sins Crew
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 3:41 pm
Mmm....
You all have a point. When he presented the evidence about Uliquiorra, my first thought was: But you're not him... and he had a second release.
This person does not. Ulquiorra, as Colm stated, would not be a best example because he was an exception. But I have a feeling that someone is gonna pull out the 2nd Ressureccion out of their a**, and we might have another problem or whenever we get the 10th Espada spot filled, someone is gonna say that they are the Cero Espada. We need to talk about those issues as well...
In that fight, however, I didn't see any problem. He was basically being creative with his shikai ability to counter him. Even though Takashi won't be able to beat him, is it really that bad for his character to be boasting/bluffing?
As for the power degeneration, I am not entirely sure about that...
We also need to figure out the power levels for Captains as well... -sigh-
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:22 pm
So far from what I've seen in the anime is that the Espada are on par, if not slightly, though very slightly, more powerful.
In my personal opinion, the higher Espada sound like they would be stronger. Mainly because they are a Hollow that became a Shinigami. This then goes on to say that Vizard would be on par with Espada.
As for what should be done for this guild, they should be considered equal. That way, it come down the abilities of the RPer and their character.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 5:39 pm
I read that kinda fast as I'm leaving out of town in a good 30 minutes.
But regardless:
I don't really feel I did anything wrong.
I would however like to argue on his Vasto Lorde statement.
He was never a Vasto Lorde according to his bio. He couldn't reach it or something. He said his power was only second to that of a Vasto Lorde which means he's weaker than a Vasto Lorde.
That's issue number 1.
Number 2:
He said he used 0.5% of his real strength but he still pulled a gran ray cero out of his a** without releasing and using...0.5% of his real power.
And for the record, Ezru is no Ulquiorra.
And yes, the whole fight I have been personally trying to piss his character off cause I was ordered to keep the guy busy, no one specifically told me I HAD to fight or kill him.
I wouldn't just release a bunch of power for nothing or waste energy.
Never originally planned on fighting the guy.
I told him to attack if he wanted and that I didn't care if he did or not.
And regarding my shikai and abilities:
My shikai is....strange?
Kind of basic.
But it allows me to do various different things with it and combinations.
I'm a strategy and think outside the box kinda guy so that's just my style I guess.
Also Ezru is reading my thoughts kinda, a little annoying.
That's my case I guess.
Be gone all weekend.
Bye.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 9:48 pm
If you lower Vizard and Arrancar power level to be par with Captain, then what will you do about Angela? She pretty much doesn't have rank or official affiliation and she's powerful as hell.
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Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 9:50 pm
I think she's about on par with Mother... Otherwise, with that sadistic psycho as their main enemy, Soul Society would be screwed. as. crap.
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![[R]eflections's avatar](https://a1cdn.gaiaonline.com/dress-up/avatar/ava/8c/62/6275cf5f42628c_flip.png?t=1739542262_6_11)
