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Wow, I wrote an English paper like that once and found the same things. No matter how you look at the world, scientifically or not...theres proof all around that God exists and created everything. That's if you're willing to truthfully look at things, of course smile

So much fallacy... where to begin?

Not really. It's a simple matter of interactional equillibrium.

Yes, you begin to die. The process of degradation is due primarily to the concept of entropy. Anyways, you're talking about an individual's physical degradation, not the mechanism of evolution which works through inheritance. An individual does not evolve, though cells may change due to various reasons, resulting in growths or decays (for lack of a better term). Normal mutation and genetic variation occurs when when gametes (sperm and egg cells) are formed, each having only half the code neccessary for a whole human being, or other organism. Aside from the randomization of alleles and traits the offspring receives, mutations occuring in the dna of the cells that divide to become gametes or in the gametes themselves are transferred to the offspring, which then exhibits a new or altered trait, or possibly even the loss of a trait.

That is pretty much THE mechanism of evolution. The idea that an individual organism within its life-time evolves is an incorrect assumption you clearly need to be disabused of.


We don't. I certainly never had (nor have) any instinctual knowledge of 'god.' i only used to think god existed because the church told me so. the problem was, i was never aware of- nor felt- any sort of presence or anything of that sort that told me it was god or that god existed. This 'instinctual knowledge' you speak of is a combination of wishful thinking (see my source of religion topic), placebo, and self-fulfilling prophecy. You were told (and think) you will 'feel' god, and your attitude is so geared to wanting to feel it that your mind makes it so you actually think you feel something. Back when I was young and used to believe, I myself tried to feel god's presence or whatever, but i never felt anything. And you can't claim i was biased either, because i believed back then and to me it was as simple as i didn't feel anything, noticed no difference or change. I could not feel what was not there.

Who says we have to have a meaning because we exist. That, my dear, is a non-sequiter. Music exists because we created it, because it is an expression of thought and emotion as certainly as speech and literature are. Music appeals to the primitive subconscious of our minds. Music is what we make of it, it's only significance and meaning is that which we give to it. Really, the music we like is a reflection of ourselves, and music we make is the projection of self. It is not divine or divinely inspired. It is communication and affirmation of self.

Untrue. For one, DNA is not perfect. There are sections of dna that don't actually code anything, they're just there. our dna codes for some ridiculous things to happen, such as: the death of cells so that instead of being one solid mass, we have fingers; inside the womb we grow hair all over (like a monkey) and then shed it sometime before we are born; the useless appendix (useless in humans anyways); a tailbone, the remnant of the tales our species' ancenstors had; etc. really, such things vouch for the lack of a design, but rather as results from gradual molding by the environment.

For another thing, all the dna in organism didn't suddenly start out complex the way it is now at the beggining of life. It was simple, and the forces that control what new and old phenotypes were successful- built new complexities upon the foundation/base that was the simple, original dna strand. Rome was not built in a day. neither was all of our dna.

Why do you assume that wanting to have a meaning proves that we actually have one? Just because you want a higher being and 'higher order' to exist doesn't mean it does exist. Taking god out of the picture means we are free to assign our own meaning to our lives. To live and die well according to ones own standards of such. Is that not religion? To live and die according to a certain standard, the reason for the standard being god, or rather your ideas/visions of 'god'?

By outside the box, you mean outside reality. Why should we concern ourselves with that which cannot affect reality because if it could, it would BE reality, not 'beyond' it.

Funny, i don't recall atheists killing people because of their religion, but i do remember all the history of religions killing each other because of their beliefs and killing atheists because of their lack of belief.

All that is begging the question (only true if the point you're trying to prove in the first place is true). There is no guarantee that we know of without a doubt that grants us eternal life or eternal anything. Ever heard of the phrase "live while you can?" You only have one life to live. After all that, it's pretty much a mystery... unless you realize that the energies that held you together have run out (entropy) and by the cyclic actions of interactional equilibrium, your components are reused in any number of things (reincarnation, if you will- you have returned from whence you came).

Morality and righteousness are all subjective ideas, not concrete truths. Is a stone right or wrong? is a squirrel right or wrong? is an action right or wrong, or simply having different outcomes? Right, wrong, good, and bad are attributes we make up and use to describe different things to relate to what affect they have on ourselves and others. There is no 'universal truth' of right and wrong because they do not exist.

I'm proud of my accomplishments and acheivments, but I don't put myself at the center of existence, just the center of MY existence. It is impossible not to do that. My existence is the only one I truly know. I have only seen through my own eyes. god or gods have had nothing to do with that. I am the center of my existence, but that does not make me selfish in the way you assume it does. really, you make god sound a selfish attention seeker.

I don't believe in god because i don't believe he exists. I cannot sense him in any way, which are the only ways in which we know of anything at all. It is as simple as that. It's not that I haven't tried opening my heart to god, he simply doesn't exist for me to experience him as religious people claim they and others do.

He helps those who help themselves? or maybe they just helped themselves by having a motivated attitude to change the way things are. Again, all of this is begging the question.

It's not about what we want or don't want, it's about what is. What you want is for there to be a god to be there to hold your hand and make sure everything eventually turns out right. If people are angry, it's because they find out that this isn't the case. We deal with what is, with what we can and can't do, what is and isn't there. As far as we know and are able to tell, god is not a part of what is. confused

I give you props for writing that, however I have a few problems.

First of all, you contradict yourself almost limitlessly. There are sentences that conflict with the sentence just above them.

Secondly, you really, really need to put this through an editor: the grammar and conventions is absolutely horrible. I admire the fact that you tried spreading everything out, and that does indeed help a bit, but there are several core functions you're lacking that would make this much easier to read.

Third, some of your points are just. . .well, lost in space.

Soul has a lot of good counter points. He also has some things I disagree with. But for the most part, I think Soul has you beaten.

However, I do think that arguing about whether God exists is ignorant. You can not debate over something that. . .well, illusive. To some, he's an imaginary friend. To others, he's almighty. There is no way either side can actually argue whether he exists or not and win. Both sides simply have to understand each other, and why they think the way they do.

By the the way, in the OP I believe you were trying to speak of something called "The Law of Man."

Read C.S. Lewis's, "Mere Christianity."

This will help you clerify your views.

Salaam~

Yes. Sadly enough, however, most people take a brush in the wrong direction. I simply want to know why some of my friends think the way they do, and I want to tell them why I believe what I believe.

I love people. Thats the biggest thing, and I'll never stop loving people. To truly experience Gods life, I think, is to love others; to do unto them with love, regardless of their acts against you.

It makes me sad to see people argue over issues they shouldn't. They should stop and breath and. . .be friends. Listen. Listen closely and learn.

Salaam~

Really? I'm sorry to say that wont get you anywhere. Maybe on the run, or possibly in jail, but nowhere other than. . .well, a sad sad place.

"It is a maddening existence where the first instinct is to kill our problems instead of deal with them."

Salaam~

It seems to be the mentality of today's world. Something not going your way? Kill the problem. Not getting what you want? Kill the problem. Angry because someone wronged you? Attack someone weaker than you to make yourself feel better.

That's debatable. So far god has not been in any of my 'honest' perspectives, whatever that means (objective?).