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Welcome to Thread Charity Thread Guild's Abortion debate; I just want to clear a few things up about this debate. This thread is to be used for educated discussion, and I have not put every single bit of information in my own words. I sadly know that most of you will not read this first page, but I strongly suggest you do so to avoid looking like a fool. I spent many, many hours working on just this first page even before it made it's way to where someone other than the mods could see it. This page is well researched, I hope you too can help make it stronger. Post any of your ideas in the Thread and maybe they will be added to the first page. I hope everyone feels their opinions are heard, but make sure you stay civil with your comments, or they will be deleted.

How to report abuse in this Thread:
Quote the person who has said something harmful to the discussion and tell me why you think this needs to be removed, if I agree, I will delete their post and edit yours to say something else. If I feel their comment was harsh enough, I will ban them from the Guild

Post 1: Table of Contents
Post 2: Terms to Know
~ Potential Sides
~ Other Terms To Know
Post 3: What is Abortion
~ Abortion Methods
~ Abortion In The Animal Kingdom
Post 4: What Makes Us Humans? We Are Animals!
~ What is a Human? What is a Person?
~ Humans Are Animals
~ A human being is one who has his or her own unique set of human DNA, IE because something is HUMAN it is a HUMAN BEING
~ Does an ability to feel make one a human being?
~ Do Animals Have Rights?
Post 5: The Main Arguments
~ The Pro-life Argument
~ The Pro-Choice Argument
Post 6: The Rape Exception
~ The Rape Exception
~ Emotional and Physical Trauma after Rape
~ Can you kill a born child who's father was a rapist?
~ The Rape Victim is not at Fault for her condition
~ Some extra information about the issue of rape and how an unwanted pregnancy can be analogous to that of an instance of rape.
~ Does the Rape Exception Make Sense?
Post 7: The Mental Punishment
~ Facing the Consequences of your Actions - The Punishment Mentality.
~ Most women who abort did not use protection - a misconception
Post 8: The Laws
~ Roe vs. Wade:
~ How this relates to the abortion debate:
~ McFall V Shimp:
~ How this relates to the abortion debate:
Post 9: The Mother’s Rights As A Woman and Mother
Post 10: The Father’s Rights As A Man and Father
Post 11: Alternatives
~ If you don't want children, Don't have sex.
~ About Abstinence
~ Responsibility
~ Adoption
~ Why Not Just get Your Tubes Tied?
Post 12: Fetal Abilities
~ What is a Fetus Capable of?
~ Is a fetus a person?
~ A Fetus Has A heart Beat
Post 13: The Mod’s Opinions
Post 14: Reserved
Post 15: The Purpose of Sex
~ Other animals that use sex for pleasure

Abortion Methods












Abortion in the Animal Kingdom
There are many animals that have abortions in the Animal Kingdom. Many of these animals will wait until the baby is actually born to kill it. So, if the other animals of the world have abortions, even after death, why shouldn't we? We are animals are we not? Many believe in the death penalty for criminals, while those people have actually gained experience in life and had memories, so how is it different if we kill a fetus.

The Pro-life Argument
1. The Cost of Abortion
2. Backstreet Abortions Increase
3. Parallels between Abortion & Slavery
4. Indisputable Medical Evidence - the Unborn baby is a Human Being
5. Abortion Aggravates Child Abuse
6. Even Legal Abortions are Unsafe
7. Increase in Breast Cancer
8. Most South Africans Oppose Abortion
9. The Overpopulation Argument
10. The Bible Declares the Sanctity of Human Life
~for more, check out this site, which is where I got this from
http://www.christianaction.org.za/articles/10rguments.htm

The Pro-Choice Argument
1. "It is uncertain when human life begins; that's a religious question that cannot be answered by science."
2. "The fetus is just a part of the pregnant woman's body, like her tonsils or appendix. You can't seriously believe a frozen embryo is an actual person."
3. "The unborn is an embryo or a fetus-just a simple blob of tissue, a product of conception-not a baby. Abortion is terminating a pregnancy, not killing a child."
4. "The fetus may be alive, but so are eggs and sperm. The fetus is a potential human being, not an actual one; it's like a blueprint not a house, an acorn not an oak tree."
5. "The unborn isn't a person, with meaningful life. It's only inches in size, and can't even think; it's less advanced than an animal, and anyway, who says people have a greater right to live than animals?"
6. "A fetus isn't a person until implantation or until quickening or viability or when it first breathes."
7. "Obviously life begins at birth. That's why we celebrate birthdays, not conception days, and why we don't have funerals following miscarriages."
8. "No one can really know that human life begins before birth."
9. "Even if the unborn are human beings, they have fewer rights than the woman. No one should be expected to donate her body as a life support system for someone else."
10. "Every person has the right to choose. It would be unfair to restrict a woman's choice by prohibiting abortion."
11. "Every woman should have control over her own body. Reproductive freedom is a basic right."
12. "Abortion is a decision between a woman and her doctor. It's no one else's business. Everyone has a constitutional right to privacy."
13. "It's unfair for an unmarried woman to have to face the embarrassment of pregnancy or the pain of giving up a child for adoption."
14. "Abortion rights are fundamental for the advancement of women. They are essential to having equal rights with men."
15. "The circumstances of many women leave them no choice but to have an abortion."
16. "I'm personally against abortion, but I'm still prochoice. It's a legal alternative and we don't have the right to keep it from anyone. Everyone's free to believe what they want, but we shouldn't try to impose it on others."
17. "'Every child a wanted child.' It's unfair to children to bring them into a world where they're not wanted."
18. "Having more unwanted children results in more child abuse."
19. "Restricting abortion would be unfair to the poor and minorities, who need it most."
20. "Abortion helps solve the problem of over-population and raises the quality of life."
21. "Even if abortion were made illegal, there would still be many abortions."
22. "The anti-abortion beliefs of the minority shouldn't be imposed on the majority."
23. "The anti-abortion position is a religious belief that threatens the vital separation of church and state."
24. "If abortion is made illegal, tens of thousands of women will again die from back-alley and clothes-hanger abortions."
25. "Abortion is a safe medical procedure, safer than full-term pregnancy and childbirth."
26. "Abortion is an easy and painless procedure."
27. "Abortion relieves women of stress and responsibility, and thereby enhances their psychological well-being."
28. "Abortion providers are respected medical professionals working in the woman's best interests."
29. "What about a woman whose life is threatened by pregnancy or childbirth?"
30. "What about a woman whose unborn baby is diagnosed as deformed or handicapped?"
31. "What about a woman who is pregnant who has fallen victim to rape or incest?"
32. "Anti-abortionists are so cruel that they insist on showing hideous pictures of dead babies."
33. "Profilers don't care about women, and they don't care about babies once they're born. They have no right to speak against abortion unless they are willing to care for these children."
34. "The anti-abortionists are a bunch of men telling women what to do."
35. "Anti-abortionists talk about the sanctity of human life, yet they favor capital punishment."
36. "Anti-abortion fanatics break the law, are violent, and bomb abortion clinics."
~ Found on http://www.epm.org/articles/pla39.html

Sorry there are more Pro-Choice than Pro-Life, I will try and fix this shortly, you can help.

Facing the Consequences of your Actions - The Punishment Mentality.
~ Every post-abortion woman has undergone a real death experience - the death of her child.
~ Grief is a natural consequence of death.

Most women who abort did not use protection - a misconception
~ Research tells us that when used consistently and correctly condoms are 98 percent effective in preventing pregnancy.
~ Experts estimate that condoms break or slip only two percent of the time.
~ Condoms are efficient if they are used properly, but not everyone knows how to actually use them. This sounds crazy, but it is true.
~ User failure is calculated by looking at 100 couples who use condoms as their primary method of birth control. Over the course of a year, about 14 of these couples will experience an unintended pregnancy during the first year.

Information found on
http://www.communityactionkit.org/pdfs/Getting_Ready_To_Advocate/Debunking_Condoms.html
http://www.hopeafterabortion.com/aftermath/index.cfm?page=angelo

~ As a woman, a woman should have the right to control her own body without objection.
~ A mother can make the choice to not be a mother.

If you don't want children, Don't have sex.
~ This is the most common comment said in the abortion debate. Although it is true, it is just not very educated.

About Abstinence
~ This is saying the same thing as “don’t have sex” but for some odd reason it just sounds better.

Responsibility
~ If someone is just going to insist on having sex, they should do it responsibly.
1. Get an STD check from both partners
2. Use a birth control pill
3. Use a condom (female and male)
4. Use a Dental Dam
5. use a diaphragm
6. intra-uterine system (IUD)
7. Hormonal implants
8. natural family planning – not recommended
9. the withdrawal method – not recommended
10. sterilization
11. Free contraception

Adoption
~ Adoption as a form of birth control. WHAT?!
~ Many people who accidentally become pregnant put their babies up for adoption. This is the most socially acceptable solution in many societies.
~ There are many homes around the world that would love to have a child of their own.
~ The risk of course is the child being put with bad parents.

Why Not Just get Your Tubes Tied?
~ This is an irreversible treatment where a woman’s fallopian tubes get blocked off so the egg can not travel down them and become fertal.