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 Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:41 pm
An absolute truth..
Well, everything exists in our imagination. Through our perception. What we know, what we see, exists to us only in our minds.. Like, that pen sitting there. We see it, it's there, but we do not know it. We can only see one side, or hold it in our hands, but we cannot prove it to ourselves any other way. We do not truly KNOW anything unless we are it.
So, one absolute truth would be... that EVERYTHING is relative.
Another is that.. I exist. Someone can question my existence, but I simply can't possibly think I don't exist. That thought alone would prove that I do.
And the last.. is that EVERYTHING is connected.
But even those are more ideas then Absolute Truths..
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Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:43 pm
AbrAbraxas i sent you a pm about my textual studies but the most important thing is to study every aspect of life and living and to refrain from judgement. there is a balance in all things and that balance or lack there of is not always evident, before you decide you know something, wonder if there is something that you dont know. i normally try and remind myself that my own knowledge is only relative and absolute knowledge is union with the absolute and there is nothing that can be done with that, it just is. another good book with a hokey name, The Mystic Path to Cosmic Power by Vernon Howard Hmm.. well said. That's why a healthy mixture of logic and intuition is always important.
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Posted: Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:59 pm
Necera An absolute truth.. Well, everything exists in our imagination. Through our perception. What we know, what we see, exists to us only in our minds.. Like, that pen sitting there. We see it, it's there, but we do not know it. We can only see one side, or hold it in our hands, but we cannot prove it to ourselves any other way. We do not truly KNOW anything unless we are it. So, one absolute truth would be... that EVERYTHING is relative. Another is that.. I exist. Someone can question my existence, but I simply can't possibly think I don't exist. That thought alone would prove that I do. And the last.. is that EVERYTHING is connected. But even those are more ideas then Absolute Truths.. but what if i truly don't exist? if everything exists in imagination, how do you or i or anyone else in this forum know, for absolute certain, that i am not just a figment of your imagination? how do we know that we aren't all just figments in the imagination of some other being, and that we don't exist in a physical sense?
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Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 3:52 pm
MegaTherion777 Necera An absolute truth.. Well, everything exists in our imagination. Through our perception. What we know, what we see, exists to us only in our minds.. Like, that pen sitting there. We see it, it's there, but we do not know it. We can only see one side, or hold it in our hands, but we cannot prove it to ourselves any other way. We do not truly KNOW anything unless we are it. So, one absolute truth would be... that EVERYTHING is relative. Another is that.. I exist. Someone can question my existence, but I simply can't possibly think I don't exist. That thought alone would prove that I do. And the last.. is that EVERYTHING is connected. But even those are more ideas then Absolute Truths.. but what if i truly don't exist? if everything exists in imagination, how do you or i or anyone else in this forum know, for absolute certain, that i am not just a figment of your imagination? how do we know that we aren't all just figments in the imagination of some other being, and that we don't exist in a physical sense? Well, we don't. I don't know if you truly exist. You're like that pen. I perceive you through your posts, and your little avi, but nothing more. Though, each an every one of us knows that we exist. And if we doubt that, we're proving it wrong. How can something non-existent think and doubt itself? When it comes to physical existence, it's very questionable. Physically speaking, we're all essentially a little bit of matter wrapped around absolute vacuum. That space between electrons and the nucleus is nothing (atoms are only a theory, of course, but what isn't) We really cant prove physical existence, because our senses are all we have and they are not ENTIRELY trust worthy. But we can prove our thoughts and being, but ONLY to ourselves. Even if we are figments of someones imagination, we exist nontheless, just not physically. But everything is relative, so "physical" is relative to what we perceive as physical. So yea.. there is no certainty. Maybe.
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Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2007 4:28 pm
okay, but do we exist as we perceive ourselves, that is, as individuals? or is that an illusion, and are we just microscopic parts of something larger - subatomic particles to some larger, more complex creature - to god perhaps?
i don't believe this, but it's interesting to think about... whaddaya think about it?
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Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:41 pm
MegaTherion777 okay, but do we exist as we perceive ourselves, that is, as individuals? or is that an illusion, and are we just microscopic parts of something larger - subatomic particles to some larger, more complex creature - to god perhaps? i don't believe this, but it's interesting to think about... whaddaya think about it? Hm... I have that idea, but a little different. I strongly believe in the inter-relation of EVERYTHING. We are here because of all the perfect chance happenings of the Earth and the universe setting the stage for our evolution. You know.. like ecosystems and food chains.. every life depends on every other life, and the balance created by that dependence is perfect as long as everything does their part. So like... in a way, we are not entirely individuals. I mean... we identify ourselves through our community just as much as we do through ourselves. If we were COMPLETELY alone in the world, I'm sure we would doubt our existence constantly. I think we need others to really be ourselves. So yea.. we kind of are subatomic particles to one BIG atom. BTW you remind me of someone... with the metal and the German and your thinking. smile
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Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 3:46 pm
HEY!
I'd hate to post this here... but someone should go visit the non-philosophical subforum. I posted an Environment thread that I wish more people would see....
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Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 4:38 pm
Necera MegaTherion777 okay, but do we exist as we perceive ourselves, that is, as individuals? or is that an illusion, and are we just microscopic parts of something larger - subatomic particles to some larger, more complex creature - to god perhaps? i don't believe this, but it's interesting to think about... whaddaya think about it? Hm... I have that idea, but a little different. I strongly believe in the inter-relation of EVERYTHING. We are here because of all the perfect chance happenings of the Earth and the universe setting the stage for our evolution. You know.. like ecosystems and food chains.. every life depends on every other life, and the balance created by that dependence is perfect as long as everything does their part. So like... in a way, we are not entirely individuals. I mean... we identify ourselves through our community just as much as we do through ourselves. If we were COMPLETELY alone in the world, I'm sure we would doubt our existence constantly. I think we need others to really be ourselves. So yea.. we kind of are subatomic particles to one BIG atom. BTW you remind me of someone... with the metal and the German and your thinking. smile i remind you of someone, eh? i don't get that very often, you have intrigued me... that is an interesting thought to play around with...but i haven't really done more than play with it.
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Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2007 10:37 pm
Necera Zephyr You can't exist without having experienced non-existence. Well.. can you experience non-existence? I agree with your point, but not the wording. We have all experienced nonexistence before we where created as sperm, therefore we have experienced nonexistence, which proves that we do exist. Also What does the question matter anyway. We can argue about it forever, but as far as I know through my perception I exist. As long as this illusion is apon me, weather it is true or not, I think I should enjoy it. Maby mess around with it a little bit. The question is not do we or do we not exist, it is that if we exist what should we do with our existence( Depending on your view on free will), and if we dont exist, what are the downsides of it. After chosing your side, it is much easyer to move on and expand your mind anymore, or atleast in my opinion lol. Maby I don't even have an opinion anyway. Oh well... Lol... Disreguard all of the above if you want. It's just my-supposedly thought to exist-opinion.
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Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2007 9:03 pm
I beleive an absoloute truth is that we should chose to believe in choice, and believe we can chose what we believe in.
I also think that we should try to find a good path for our lives and stick with it.
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 6:40 am
I_27_04 Necera Zephyr You can't exist without having experienced non-existence. Well.. can you experience non-existence? I agree with your point, but not the wording. We have all experienced nonexistence before we where created as sperm, therefore we have experienced nonexistence, which proves that we do exist. Also What does the question matter anyway. We can argue about it forever, but as far as I know through my perception I exist. As long as this illusion is apon me, weather it is true or not, I think I should enjoy it. Maby mess around with it a little bit. The question is not do we or do we not exist, it is that if we exist what should we do with our existence( Depending on your view on free will), and if we dont exist, what are the downsides of it. After chosing your side, it is much easyer to move on and expand your mind anymore, or atleast in my opinion lol. Maby I don't even have an opinion anyway. Oh well... Lol... Disreguard all of the above if you want. It's just my-supposedly thought to exist-opinion. hindu culture abounds with the accounts of people experiencing a state of void, which would i assume be similar to non-existence, true this could be a state before birth as well as a state temporarily attainable while alive. true also that arguing about existence is a never ending and unprovable topic, i think as I2704 said we should consider what we will do with the existence that we have we should also as we are already doing here consider where we sit in the realms of existence. that as the cells of our body may exist independent of the rest of our body with cell walls and organs of their own, we too may be cells of a larger living being, depending on in part other cells. plant animals and minerals as well as other humans. we could take more cosmic perspective and speculate as to whether our activities have an energetic impact on existence as a whole or if we are just sparks in the dark. is it our task to make a big mess of everything as we so well do or are meant to take care of things? asking questions of the self doesnt hurt, but be careful what we do with the answers
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 11:36 am
Well actually I was just saying the first thing that came to my mind to soudn kule, and to beat that stupid paradox that guy said, but ur thing works too.
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:35 pm
I_27_04 Necera Zephyr You can't exist without having experienced non-existence. Well.. can you experience non-existence? I agree with your point, but not the wording. We have all experienced nonexistence before we where created as sperm, therefore we have experienced nonexistence, which proves that we do exist. Also What does the question matter anyway. We can argue about it forever, but as far as I know through my perception I exist. As long as this illusion is apon me, weather it is true or not, I think I should enjoy it. Maby mess around with it a little bit. The question is not do we or do we not exist, it is that if we exist what should we do with our existence( Depending on your view on free will), and if we dont exist, what are the downsides of it. After chosing your side, it is much easyer to move on and expand your mind anymore, or atleast in my opinion lol. Maby I don't even have an opinion anyway. Oh well... Lol... Disreguard all of the above if you want. It's just my-supposedly thought to exist-opinion. I agree with you. We exist. I know I exist, and my main concern is what to do with this existence. smile I just think wording is important, and you can't experience nonexistence. thats all im saying.. hehe. you can just not exist. You can't experience at all if you dont exist. That was my only petty complaint.. but that aside, yes to you! *thumbs up*
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 2:23 pm
Necera I_27_04 Necera Zephyr You can't exist without having experienced non-existence. Well.. can you experience non-existence? I agree with your point, but not the wording. We have all experienced nonexistence before we where created as sperm, therefore we have experienced nonexistence, which proves that we do exist. Also What does the question matter anyway. We can argue about it forever, but as far as I know through my perception I exist. As long as this illusion is apon me, weather it is true or not, I think I should enjoy it. Maby mess around with it a little bit. The question is not do we or do we not exist, it is that if we exist what should we do with our existence( Depending on your view on free will), and if we dont exist, what are the downsides of it. After chosing your side, it is much easyer to move on and expand your mind anymore, or atleast in my opinion lol. Maby I don't even have an opinion anyway. Oh well... Lol... Disreguard all of the above if you want. It's just my-supposedly thought to exist-opinion. I agree with you. We exist. I know I exist, and my main concern is what to do with this existence. smile I just think wording is important, and you can't experience nonexistence. thats all im saying.. hehe. you can just not exist. You can't experience at all if you dont exist. That was my only petty complaint.. but that aside, yes to you! *thumbs up* Maby you should get a job, find sombody who you can tolorate for a long time, make sure you love him, marry him, raise good children, lead a happy life. Or maby be like one of those single female loyers who don't take crud from anybody. Or somthign else... Or somthign like that... I have no idea man its ur choice. Just chose a path you like and follow it.
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Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 3:17 pm
*shakes head at pathetic hippie who probably doesn't realize how easily someone could get offended by what he just said*
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