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 Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 3:34 pm
1) She had misleading statistics. With no proof of her original statement.
2) Give me one moral standard that is throughout all countries at this day and age, that isn't based upon the State.
3) I thought being aggressive was looked down upon in debates.
4) Of course.
5) Don't quote-break.
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 4:14 pm
Jacko Vance 1) She had misleading statistics. With no proof of her original statement. 2) Give me one moral standard that is throughout all countries at this day and age, that isn't based upon the State. 3) I thought being aggressive was looked down upon in debates. 4) Of course. 5) Don't quote-break. 1) She has the right to use statistics. 2) Governement should try its best to make its citzens happy 3) I can always tone down my agressiveness in Debates, but its great for sparring! 3nodding 4) Again 3nodding 5) Kick me out of the guild if my behavior insults you so much. I like this guild, but if you want to throw me out, throw me out.
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 4:53 pm
Jacko Vance What are morals? What sets said morals? With all the "multiculturalism" promoted around America and in some European countries, you'd think we would have various sets of morals. Which we do. Morals are just guidance for life. My morals and ethics differ from yours. Jacko, you are correct when it comes to morals. Everyone has different morals and values - but as a nation we all share certain morals. And for everyone talking about morals and the Law: The law considers itself independent of morality, even if the law happens to reflect morality. Also Jacko, earlier you said: Jacko Vance Lemondream. "contemporary norms" are a product of society. Which is a fantastic truth - obviously I was unclear, and I'm sorry for that.
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 5:59 pm
SoccerRocker.
1) Of course she does. It's just misleading.
2-62967) Why should government try to make it's citizens happy?
And...Sparring?
(HO's**t. Didn't see all demz postz!)
Nappy.
I said they were misleading because you talked about how people were wrongfully executed, yet you linked to a page where it listed wrongly convicted to death sentence people who have been let off.
>_>
In other words, you didn't give one name of a person who had been wrongfully executed.
And about the "perfectly fine organization"...Let's not get into the ACLU's credibility shall we?
Lemondream.
How is it society's fault for the slow system?
Not a utopian dictatorship.
Keyword: doubt. Any cold, hard proof?
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Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2006 6:55 pm
Jacko Vance Nappy. I said they were misleading because you talked about how people were wrongfully executed, yet you linked to a page where it listed wrongly convicted to death sentence people who have been let off. >_> In other words, you didn't give one name of a person who had been wrongfully executed. And about the "perfectly fine organization"...Let's not get into the ACLU's credibility shall we?
And the stats I provided still reinforce my point.
The people on death row were meant to be executed.
I'm willing to bet that they weren't just sitting there for a few weeks - it's usually years due to the appeas process.
So it's not like the government quickly realizes its mistakes and things go back to normal...(generally).
Because these 102 people aren't the only innocents on death row.
They're just the ones who were released.
This doesn't include the ones who were executed, but since they are dead cannot go back to court.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 3:19 am
Well don't talk about wrongly executed people and not give one shred of hard undeniable proof.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 7:03 am
Jacko Vance SoccerRocker. 1) Of course she does. It's just misleading. 2-62967) Why should government try to make it's citizens happy? And...Sparring? (HO's**t. Didn't see all demz postz!) Nappy. I said they were misleading because you talked about how people were wrongfully executed, yet you linked to a page where it listed wrongly convicted to death sentence people who have been let off. >_> In other words, you didn't give one name of a person who had been wrongfully executed. And about the "perfectly fine organization"...Let's not get into the ACLU's credibility shall we? Lemondream. How is it society's fault for the slow system? Not a utopian dictatorship. Keyword: doubt. Any cold, hard proof? 1) 4laugh 2) Sparring: I minute speech aff, 1 min speech neg, 5 minutes of crossfire, Neg 2 minute ending speech, Aff 2 minute ending speech. People are the blood of a government, if you make your own people unhappy, you're 1984 idealistic govt. won't work as smoothly as it could if the people were happy with their governement.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 12:01 pm
SoccerRocker1234 Jacko Vance SoccerRocker. 1) Of course she does. It's just misleading. 2-62967) Why should government try to make it's citizens happy? And...Sparring? (HO's**t. Didn't see all demz postz!) Nappy. I said they were misleading because you talked about how people were wrongfully executed, yet you linked to a page where it listed wrongly convicted to death sentence people who have been let off. >_> In other words, you didn't give one name of a person who had been wrongfully executed. And about the "perfectly fine organization"...Let's not get into the ACLU's credibility shall we? Lemondream. How is it society's fault for the slow system? Not a utopian dictatorship. Keyword: doubt. Any cold, hard proof? 1) 4laugh 2) Sparring: I minute speech aff, 1 min speech neg, 5 minutes of crossfire, Neg 2 minute ending speech, Aff 2 minute ending speech. People are the blood of a government, if you make your own people unhappy, you're 1984 idealistic govt. won't work as smoothly as it could if the people were happy with their governement. People would be happy that more criminals are off the streets. And recent polls tell the tale of an unhappy majority that is thoroughly ticked off at the current judicial system's slow processes. BE HAPPY OR DIE. Ignorance is bliss. =D And I've honestly never seen a sardonic question or response in a legitimate, regulated debate.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 1:04 pm
Jacko Vance People would be happy that more criminals are off the streets.
Perhaps some people would be happier that execution keeps people off the street, perhaps some would be unhappy as well.
Don't lump them all together, you are not all people.
And here are some legal cases for you"
Lena Baker
The infamous Sacco and Vanzetti (They were not pardoned, but their innocence/guilt was up in the air)
William Jackson Marion
Clyde Kennard (Was not executed, but was pardoned after death)
Just for kicks, here is the link to the Northwestern University Law School's Center on Wrongful Convictons: Here.
And I still assert that my previous statistics were competely relevant.
There aren't many cases of posthumous pardons simply because many attorneys won't go into these cases when they can make more money with present-day cases that have live witnesses.
If one of your main witnesses is dead, it's kind of hard to make your point.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 4:10 pm
Jacko Vance SoccerRocker1234 Jacko Vance SoccerRocker. 1) Of course she does. It's just misleading. 2-62967) Why should government try to make it's citizens happy? And...Sparring? (HO's**t. Didn't see all demz postz!) Nappy. I said they were misleading because you talked about how people were wrongfully executed, yet you linked to a page where it listed wrongly convicted to death sentence people who have been let off. >_> In other words, you didn't give one name of a person who had been wrongfully executed. And about the "perfectly fine organization"...Let's not get into the ACLU's credibility shall we? Lemondream. How is it society's fault for the slow system? Not a utopian dictatorship. Keyword: doubt. Any cold, hard proof? 1) 4laugh 2) Sparring: I minute speech aff, 1 min speech neg, 5 minutes of crossfire, Neg 2 minute ending speech, Aff 2 minute ending speech. People are the blood of a government, if you make your own people unhappy, you're 1984 idealistic govt. won't work as smoothly as it could if the people were happy with their governement. People would be happy that more criminals are off the streets. And recent polls tell the tale of an unhappy majority that is thoroughly ticked off at the current judicial system's slow processes. BE HAPPY OR DIE. Ignorance is bliss. =D And I've honestly never seen a sardonic question or response in a legitimate, regulated debate. In the words of my debate coach "Sparring is basically an argument with a nice name to it" (Boo-ya!) Also directly on the judging sheet it says there should be 'clash'. Don't think you know more than someone who is on the debate team. You'll lose. And the system may have problems but it doesn't mean we install harsher punishments for criminals. (Oh, and please give me a link as you stated to Lemon Dream of these polls) And 'Be happy or die' and 'ignorance is bliss'???? I have no comments on this, I don't even need to argue that myself. On a more light note, Jacko your avi is hideous. I liked the old one better, it had more class.
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Posted: Wed Nov 15, 2006 8:01 pm
Jacko Vance Lemondream. How is it society's fault for the slow system? Not a utopian dictatorship. Keyword: doubt. Any cold, hard proof? It is society's fault because society, in part, creates criminals. If the system weren't so backed up, bogged down, busy, and congested the system would not be so slow. How is society at fault for creating criminals? Look up Robert Merton's Strain Theory or the legendary Emile Durkheim's anomie. "Social structures exert a definite pressure upon certain persons in the society to engage in non-conforming rather than conforming conduct (Merton, 1957)." (Specifially refering to acieveing culturally defined goals) What are Merton's culturally defined goals? In Western society, including the U.S., they are primarily monetary and material success. "Making it," within the scope of the American Dream, involves being affluent - rich if possible. A crucial point is that not all societies are so materialistic; some place an emphasis on entirely different goals, such as spirituality, wisdom, or learning. However, there are limitations on how to achieve culturally defined goals. While nearly everyone in our society may value wealth, it is a separate question as to how we are to acquire that wealth. If there are no "structurally available oppurtunities" to achieve those goals. If there are no legitimate ways to achieve it, a person may turn to illegitimate means - crime, i.e. drug dealers in urban areas and the under-class. ----- And what about a utopian dictatorship? I am speaking specifically of the United State's legal system, in which the law considers itself independent of morality. This is not true everywhere: In South Africa, the government is attempting to create a Moral Regeneration movement. Part of this is a proposed Bill of Morals, which will bring a biblical-based "moral code" into the realm of law. ----- Proof of what? You said yourself that Jacko Vance "contemporary norms" are a product of society .
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Posted: Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:40 pm
Jacko Vance YHELOTHAR! What is your stance on the current punishments dealt by the American legal system? Or any nations legal system. I personally beleive that harsher punishments should be awarded for every crime. Jail sentence should be an inevitable result of even simple vandalism, and death to all who kill, and maybe even to theives and rapists and ***** you don't know it's wrong when you do it, you most likely won't realize it's wrong afterwards. More Rehab, less 'Lock 'em up'. Eliminate Capital Punishment. Life in prison is a death sentence anyways. Hmm. . .killing people for theft. I like that. Lets start with Halliburton, for their embellzement and fraud involving the relief money for Hurricane Katrina. Cheney first, cause he doesn't have much longer to go anyways. What's that? You accidently smacked someone with your car, and he died? Well, off with your head. Oh? You're a doctor and you mis-operated? Off with your head too, we don't need more doctors. This is a Democracy, not a Fascist Dictatorship. We care about our people.
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Posted: Sat Dec 02, 2006 7:53 am
Accidents happen. But an accident shows just how much of a liability you are. The State is better off without such a liability, lest it kills more people.
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Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 8:17 am
Jacko Vance Accidents happen. But an accident shows just how much of a liability you are. The State is better off without such a liability, lest it kills more people.
So what, we're supposed to kill off the entire population?
No.
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Posted: Sun Dec 03, 2006 9:35 am
Nappy Jacko Vance Accidents happen. But an accident shows just how much of a liability you are. The State is better off without such a liability, lest it kills more people.
So what, we're supposed to kill off the entire population?
No. How many people kill people through accidents?
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