|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
 Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 9:35 am
Question, because I can't quite remember and my book is all the way upstairs in my room...
Did Tom see his parents when they had died? Er... whatever... Did he see their bodies? I remember a scene where he saw his mother dead or something of the sort... *scratches skull*
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2007 5:21 pm
And power-hungry Slytherin loved those of great ambition...|> ---|He didn't see his mother die, but he saw his father die (seeing as he killed him).|--- <|Slytherin Pride!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:16 pm
We agreed on the other thread, that Tom's insanity is based because of his history of inbreeding on the Gaunts side of the family. Honestly, with Merope's dad as Tom's grandfather, how could the poor boy not turn out slightly deranged? That guy was nuts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Sep 25, 2007 9:52 am
well my grandmother was nuts and I like to think that I won't go mental and want to kill all Germans just to prove a point. I think the Tom was mentally and emotionally abused as a child. When people see things that they cannot comprehend they get a little violent. (ex: the Dursleys) And if the books take place in the 1980's which they are supposed too then Tom would have grown up in the 1930's and back then people were a heck of a lot less understanding then they are now.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Sep 25, 2007 12:52 pm
Well, it's true that being inbred does affect the temperment and/or the physical characteristics of a child. So, it's possible that Tom's mental instability could originate from his inbred lineage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 12:09 am
colonelhavoc well my grandmother was nuts and I like to think that I won't go mental and want to kill all Germans just to prove a point. I think the Tom was mentally and emotionally abused as a child. When people see things that they cannot comprehend they get a little violent. (ex: the Dursleys) And if the books take place in the 1980's which they are supposed too then Tom would have grown up in the 1930's and back then people were a heck of a lot less understanding then they are now. And power-hungry Slytherin loved those of great ambition...|> ---|But the hatred of Germans that you're talking about was most likely a result of conditioning. Genetically inherited madness is something different altogether.|--- <|Slytherin Pride!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:47 am
Very true, Jay. When you have something that could alter your genes, like... being inbred, then it's impossible to somehow change how people will be. Being clinically insane is like being sick with Torretts. You can't stop it... it just doesn't work that way. But, with your Grandpa, she was raised a certain way so that she hated Germans and everything they believed in. Hating Germans isn't exactly in her blood. It's not a mutation. Just... being human.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:14 pm
no no no I mean that she was just plain wacko. She was German though and so like I hope that I wouldn't want to kill all Germans just because she was German and made my life miserable. Even though I'm not inbred(I hope!) it still has some of the same principles.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 12:11 pm
But, what I'm saying is that her craziness isn't genetic - it's not in her blood, in her genes. She wasn't born crazy... she was raised to be crazy.
I'm genetically insane. I'm not in-bred or anything, but two of my ancestors were clinically insane. One of them locked his family in a cabin for the winter when he went camping. His name was Doc Baker. Pretty insane, that one.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2007 9:18 pm
And power-hungry Slytherin loved those of great ambition...|> ---|Finora's right; there's a world of difference between physiological mental illness and indoctrination. Voldemort had the former; your grandmother, Havoc, probably had the latter.|--- <|Slytherin Pride!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:15 pm
well sure just go and pop my bubble! And here I thought there was a reason for my insanity!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 9:21 am
From the information given, how can either of you know that Havoc's grandmother wasn't clinically insane, at least inasmuch as was Finora's ancestor?
I think that Tom's insanity can be explained as follows:
- As a child, he had a great deal of power at a very, very young age
- he lived in an environment where there was probably not much to go around, so he learned to use his power to his advantage
- by the time he was eleven, the 'power corrupts' rule comes into play. His inbreeding may have contributed to his lack of morals as well, to this point
- he goes off to a school where, suddenly, he is all-powerful. This must be devastating, so he must work harder to reign supreme over his peers.
It's a logical progression, from there. His Muggle heritage would put him at a disadvantage in Slytherin, of course he would come to despise it.
In conclusion, I do not believe that young Tom was abused, mentally or emotionally. I think he was, perhaps, neglected, but not on purpose. It was clear from Dumbledore's memory that the orphanage owner tried her best, but with 30-40 kids to deal with, no one had the time to make sure Tom, who would have needed extra attention, was growing up right.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2007 7:20 pm
You make a good point Kat. I still blame Dumbles for that. If the school can know all muggleborns when they need to come to hogwarts how can they not figure out when the kids are born. No magical child should be brought up in a muggle orphanage, even a good one! IF you're different in the slightest way then you are neglected by most of your peers.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 4:07 pm
And power-hungry Slytherin loved those of great ambition...|> ---|Harry was brought up by Muggles who hated him and neglected him at every opportunity, and yet he didn't become a psychopathic killer. The reason? Upbringing can only account for so much. Harry didn't have the potential to become that person (or if he did, his intrinsic good nature prevented it from happening), whereas Voldemort did.
Kat: You're right, I don't know, but the description Havoc gave points to a problem that is due in part to indoctrination. It's possible that clinical insanity came with old age, but the fact is that most of those sorts of things do need a basis for development - stress, trauma, conditioning and so on.|--- <|Slytherin Pride!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 8:57 am
Yes, Kat, it's possible that Havoc's grandmother may be genetically insane, but as Jay said, the information given to us made us believe that she became nutty from how she grew up.
And, I think we stick to the point that Tom had something wrong with his brain.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Reply
